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Off Topic => Everything Else => Debate Den => Topic started by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 03, 2006, 07:19:28 pm

Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 03, 2006, 07:19:28 pm: After a converstaion with msp, the thought crossed my mind. I asked him why he hated all the gay people. He said he only hated the male gay people. I can understand when guys are kinda creeped out, because well they wouldnt want a gay guy crushing on them, they think they are so big and manly and everything. But if you notice, more and more people are fine with two lesbians and find it attractive for them to be together and holding hands and making out. Why? They are the same as men being gay. Msp said he doesn't mind 2 lesbians making out in front of him, he finds it attractive. Well why aren't gay men found attractive? they dont like girls, thats why they are gay. Lesbians dont like men, thats why they are lesbian, so what makes them more attractive? I'm Bi and swing either way, and i find two gay guys together very attractive, and females, but thats just me.
So i dont understand why peoples reactions are wayyy different towards two gay men being together and it being "disgusting", but two lesbians together and it being "hott". They are commiting the same thing and yet they are treated unfair for it. I dont know if anyone else agrees with me or anything, but that idea came to my head and i wanted to know what others thought.

Anywho, I figured this would do best in the debate den. Post your beliefs and opinions on this subject, and back up your reasoning. I want to see a good solid debate...
:happy:

EDIT: sorry, "racist" might not be the best word. But maybe more judgmental, thinking they are worse than 2 lesbians compared to each other. The lesbians being the "least" of the two "evils". I cant put it any other way really. Rascist, being against, was the word i thought up. Sorry for not being able to find a better usage or word..
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Patback399 on June 03, 2006, 07:20:07 pm: "Racist" against gays?
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: IceFox on June 03, 2006, 07:29:36 pm: Yes, because, you will see often that many people don't mention lesibians, but mention gay rights for men.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 03, 2006, 07:31:35 pm: Wow intelligent post! You really like correcting people don't you. I'm sure people understood what i was trying to say. There aren't many other "words" you can really use for being against gays. So i think i'lll create one now. Not racist but how about gaysist? Thats fine and dandy, gaysist will be the word of choice for people who are against gays...

EDIT: that was ment for patback not you^^^
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Chrono on June 03, 2006, 08:19:17 pm: You've pretty much answered your own question already. Straight men find lesbians making out (or more) attractive (or hawt), but not two gay men making out (or mroe) attractive (or hawt)

And the word gaysist is possibly the dumbest thing you could ever say...
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 03, 2006, 08:24:12 pm: well thanks for ruining my debate, and im sure whoever used the word "gaydar" was also told the same thing. I'm so glad you really like to ruin the fun in things, really.
and no i havent answered my own question, because its my OPINION maybe someone else could be different. dont ruin it for others, please.

some people just like to kill the fun..to suck the fun outta everything...
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Patback399 on June 03, 2006, 09:05:34 pm: Wow. You're really making a mountain out of a molehill.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: garyfan on June 04, 2006, 06:34:07 am: Also consider you WERE talking to MSP. I mean, I don't know that many people who are racist against gays, I mean, it is their own feelings, so I could care less.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: bub1028 on June 04, 2006, 06:42:30 am: It just depends on whether the person deciding likes men or women.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: IceFox on June 04, 2006, 09:14:10 am: Prejudice, Discrimnatory (sp?) are two words I can think of off the bat.

And no one is ruining your debate, they are putting in opinions and correcting you. Your sabvotging your own debate by getting upset about it/
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 04, 2006, 12:19:25 pm: well im not trying to..well whatever, some people may think different, thats why i put the debate up. and yes i know i talked to msp, but the idea really had nothing involing him or anything, i used him as an example. the idea crossed my mind and i wanted to see what others thought.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: BiggerSquarierSpongier on June 04, 2006, 12:47:01 pm: Okay, I know I said I was leaving the debate den for a while, and I did. But now I'm back.

Yes, I do think people are more against gay men than women, but I still don't think it's any more right for women to be homosexual than men. Homosexuality is wrong in general, and I'm getting tired of people accepting it as if it's an okay thing.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 04, 2006, 01:07:56 pm: it is an okay thing. i have heard a gay guy say he cant help being gay. he just finds himself attracted to men and cant help it. he wishes he were straight, i mean he is the most major hunk youd ever meet, buthe just cant help who he likes or finds attractive.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Dragon Of Grief on June 04, 2006, 01:09:27 pm: Quote
Okay, I know I said I was leaving the debate den for a while, and I did. But now I'm back.

Yes, I do think people are more against gay men than women, but I still don't think it's any more right for women to be homosexual than men. Homosexuality is wrong in general, and I'm getting tired of people accepting it as if it's an okay thing.
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And I am tired of you religious activists who can't give any other reason for not accepting gays other then "God says it's wrong." How do you know God says it's wrong? Maybe perhaps the bible is wrong? Ever thought about that?
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 04, 2006, 01:14:01 pm: Even though im a born again christian from just today, i still believe in homosexuals and everything. The pastor said for any lesbians/gays/ homosexulas to join their group on a certain date so they could help them go straight. i was kinda ::Dolphin Noise::ed at that. people are who they are. you cant change them, and no one sould try to just because of their beliefs.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: BiggerSquarierSpongier on June 04, 2006, 01:27:23 pm: Quote
it is an okay thing. i have heard a gay guy say he cant help being gay. he just finds himself attracted to men and cant help it. he wishes he were straight, i mean he is the most major hunk youd ever meet, buthe just cant help who he likes or finds attractive.
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Like I've said before, being attracted to someone of the same sex isn't necessarily wrong. But acting on that attraction is. Just because somebody wants to do something doesn't necessarily make it right.

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And I am tired of you religious activists who can't give any other reason for not accepting gays other then "God says it's wrong." How do you know God says it's wrong? Maybe perhaps the bible is wrong? Ever thought about that?
I don't hate gay people or anything, I just hate the fact that people are accepting homosexuality. If men were supposed to be with men, why are there women, too? Why isn't the world all men or all women if we are supposed to be gay? That's not how it works.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 04, 2006, 01:28:25 pm: uhmm well people can choose who they want to be with. religion is the evil of everyones life..people go crazy over it
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: SpongeBrain on June 04, 2006, 01:34:20 pm: I'm good with both.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: carterhawk on June 04, 2006, 03:24:45 pm: Being a straight guy who is in to chicks, there is nothing hotter than two chicks getting it on :D

more power to the gay community!
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Lil Loco on June 04, 2006, 05:48:07 pm: s
t
f
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Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: oscar_the_grouch on June 04, 2006, 10:26:02 pm: Quote
Being a straight guy who is in to chicks, there is nothing hotter than two chicks getting it on :D

more power to the gay community!
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That is a discusting comment you should of kept to yourself. Don't speak for all straight males. I know a fare share who do not get any pleasure out of that. Two females doing that to turn a guy on is one thing, but if you actually are a lesbian you do not want to turn men on.

Anyways, I think gay men are more frowned apon because females do not penatrate eachother. The thought of it doesn't repulse as many people, because lesbians have no dolphin noise. Thinking about it logically they cannot have actual sex.

Annd, speaking for my group of friends, it is just as attractive for two guys to makeout as two girls. Homosexuality is not only supported in the scene of kids I hangout with, its strongly encouraged. Downtown Vancouver is a very openly gay area. If you are gay, no one cares. You aren't going to get harassed or beaten up for it.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 05, 2006, 06:27:48 am: I wish it were that way here, it would be alot better..
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Daniel on June 05, 2006, 08:55:34 am: Quote
Being a straight guy who is in to chicks, there is nothing hotter than two chicks getting it on :D

more power to the gay community!
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That is the worst thing you ever said. I DO NOT LIKE 2 CHICKS MAKING OUT. Not all guys do. Don't act like everyone is like you. :-)
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: oscar_the_grouch on June 05, 2006, 01:53:26 pm: Quote
Quote
Being a straight guy who is in to chicks, there is nothing hotter than two chicks getting it on :D

more power to the gay community!
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That is the worst thing you ever said. I DO NOT LIKE 2 CHICKS MAKING OUT. Not all guys do. Don't act like everyone is like you. :-)
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Thank-you Daneil for agreeing with my previous post. Not everyone likes the same thing, and carterhawk seems to think everyone shares his brain.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: ernest310 on June 05, 2006, 05:55:06 pm: Well, no one's mentioned it, but the equivalent of "racism" for gays and lesbians is either "homophobia" or "heterosexism." There's all sorts of debate on which word is more effective.

Anyway, while gay men and lesbians are generally frowned upon in society, gay men tend to have it worse. This is nothing new.

Back in the 1950s, homosexuality was viewed as a mental illness or disorder, a characterization that did not change until 1973 (74?), when the American Psychological Assocation took it off the list, partially in response to the gay rights movement which had been in full swing (no pun intended) for about half a decade.

Back then, it was called "gender inversion"; gay men wanted to be women and vice versa. It is for this reason that we see the roots of lesbianism being a little less stigmatized. "Oh, they want to be men," was the reasoning of the time, which to many of them made sense, considering that men had the power. But for men to want to be women? Sissies!

Unfortunately, the most common reason has already been given (straight men seeing 2 women "get it on.")

In other news:

Organizations run by religious groups with the express purpose of attempting to shift one's homosexual orientation to heterosexual are called "ex-gay ministries," and they are extremely controversial. There are myriad stories of gays and lesbians now in committed, monogamous heterosexual relationships.

"Reparative therapy" is the same thing without the religious bent. Just as controversial. The primary impulse here is that (at least for men) homosexuality is "caused" by a weak relationship with dad that gets sexualized upon hitting puberty. In other words, one's homosexuality is simply a manifestation of other social/emotional issues that went unmet or unaddressed in childhood. Address those issues, and change (according to them anyway) can happen. There's obviously more to it than that, and I've hardly done it justice, but that's the theory, in a nutshell.

FYI, the two gay male founders of the umbrella ex-gay ministry group (Exodus International) actually ended up falling in love with one another. Several key leaders have also been spotted in embarrassing places (John Paulk, for example, was photographed at a gay bar in Washington DC. Paulk is one of those individuals mentioned above--he was a drag queen who became "ex-gay" and got married. There was a Newsweek cover story about them in 1998. I'm not sure what he's up to now--the gay bar incident happened in 2000.)

So needless to say the jury is still out on the ex-gay/reparative therapy issue.

I hope I've clarified some of the debate.
Title: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: VulturEMaN on June 05, 2006, 07:56:36 pm: Quote
Quote
Being a straight guy who is in to chicks, there is nothing hotter than two chicks getting it on :D

more power to the gay community!
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That is a discusting comment you should of kept to yourself. Don't speak for all straight males. I know a fare share who do not get any pleasure out of that. Two females doing that to turn a guy on is one thing, but if you actually are a lesbian you do not want to turn men on.

Anyways, I think gay men are more frowned apon because females do not penatrate eachother. The thought of it doesn't repulse as many people, because lesbians have no dolphin noise. Thinking about it logically they cannot have actual sex.

Annd, speaking for my group of friends, it is just as attractive for two guys to makeout as two girls. Homosexuality is not only supported in the scene of kids I hangout with, its strongly encouraged. Downtown Vancouver is a very openly gay area. If you are gay, no one cares. You aren't going to get harassed or beaten up for it.
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Ladies and Gentern00ts...although some of you may think the comment is disgusting, please use your knowledge in your own posts to disseminate why he made such a comment (is disseminate a word? LOL)....

Think with me here: If Downtown Vancouver is an openly gay area, isn't there the possibility that an area can exist where people are open about liking 2 women 'gettin it on'?

I know that a survey was taken in my school. These are approximate answers to what the survey actually said...i can't remember the exact percentages..

70% of people were AGAINST allowing gay marriages
but....
85% of guys wouldn't mind to see 2 girls together

I personally had a girlfriend who had a very close neighbor friend who happened to be a girl. I saw them kiss one time and was like W. T. F......but then I learned that I could care less....cause +2 is always better than one, except with cancer and golf....

I don't know exactly how to explain what I'm trying to say (because my stupidity restrains me forever), but I hope you get the picture.

Quite possibly, carterhawk grew up in an area similar to mine in it's mentality....who knows.

Alls that I know is that cheese tastes so gd good.....omg
Title: Re: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Dragon Of Grief on June 07, 2006, 10:18:05 pm: Quote from: carterhawk on June 04, 2006, 03:24:45 pm
Being a straight guy who is in to chicks, there is nothing hotter than two chicks getting it on :D

more power to the gay community!
You have no brain in your head do you?
Title: Re: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Sb129 on June 08, 2006, 11:03:07 am: Yes,they are you barely hear Lesbian on the news,but I could care less if someone is gay or not.I'm not big into the religion *dolphin noise*.
Title: Re: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Dragon Of Grief on June 09, 2006, 02:51:36 pm: Quote from: BiggerSquarierSpongier on June 04, 2006, 01:27:23 pm
Quote
it is an okay thing. i have heard a gay guy say he cant help being gay. he just finds himself attracted to men and cant help it. he wishes he were straight, i mean he is the most major hunk youd ever meet, buthe just cant help who he likes or finds attractive.
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Like I've said before, being attracted to someone of the same sex isn't necessarily wrong. But acting on that attraction is. Just because somebody wants to do something doesn't necessarily make it right.

Quote
And I am tired of you religious activists who can't give any other reason for not accepting gays other then "God says it's wrong." How do you know God says it's wrong? Maybe perhaps the bible is wrong? Ever thought about that?
I don't hate gay people or anything, I just hate the fact that people are accepting homosexuality. If men were supposed to be with men, why are there women, too? Why isn't the world all men or all women if we are supposed to be gay? That's not how it works.

Everytime you enter this debate all you can do is add on about how religion condemns it and how it is unnatural, wrong, against god, blah blah blah. Come up with a better reason then your religion, because guess what? Not EVERYBODY believes in Christianity... why should a whole population suffer just because some old, conservative, men can force their beliefs among the whole populace not just homosexuals, but people in religion. The only reason gay marriage is illegal is because of religion. There is no other founded facts why it shouldn't be legalized. And it is slowly being approved around the US... it is only a matter of time before every state in the US allows it.

So yeah, come back to me when you can think of a halfway decent reason why homosexuals don't deserve to be accept. They can't be opinions... they have to be proven facts... good luck.
Title: Re: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: DiE HaRrD PuNk on June 09, 2006, 07:40:03 pm: that was really good Ty!!^^ ^_^
Title: Re: Are people more against gay men then women?
Post by: Dragon Of Grief on June 10, 2006, 08:40:04 am: I am so tempted to post the pic of my boyfriend and I kissing... I want to so bad. Hahaha.