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Off Topic => Everything Else => Debate Den => Topic started by: MiraclrPlz on September 12, 2004, 07:43:36 pm
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That fat slob, Michael Moore, has decided to give up his oscar nomination for his lying documentary to put it on T.V. before the election. "If Bush loses, that will be my oscar." All this will only hurt Kerry. The Democrats that saw the filth loved it, thinking in their minds it would destroy Bush. LMAO. The half that hated it, the Republicans, knew it was a documentary of garbage and lies. The Democrats feed off fear, but nobody is scared. Kerry is still going to lose. His downward plunge in the polls has got the Liberals furious, but nothing can save him now. I can't wait until everyone sees the movie and sees all the lies.
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That fat slob, Michael Moore, has decided to give up his oscar nomination for his lying documentary to put it on T.V. before the election. "If Bush loses, that will be my oscar." All this will only hurt Kerry. The Democrats that saw the filth loved it, thinking in their minds it would destroy Bush. LMAO. The half that hated it, the Republicans, knew it was a documentary of garbage and lies. The Democrats feed off fear, but nobody is scared. Kerry is still going to lose. His downward plunge in the polls has got the Liberals furious, but nothing can save him now. I can't wait until everyone sees the movie and sees all the lies.
I couldn't agree more.
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MSP, you freak. You don't have to take that movie so seriously.
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You know...as far as I can tell by what I've read of his, his stuff is Satirical. He's MAKING FUN OF. Pfft. Vote Oprah instead.
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That fat slob, Michael Moore, has decided to give up his oscar nomination for his lying documentary to put it on T.V. before the election. "If Bush loses, that will be my oscar." All this will only hurt Kerry. The Democrats that saw the filth loved it, thinking in their minds it would destroy Bush. LMAO. The half that hated it, the Republicans, knew it was a documentary of garbage and lies. The Democrats feed off fear, but nobody is scared. Kerry is still going to lose. His downward plunge in the polls has got the Liberals furious, but nothing can save him now. I can't wait until everyone sees the movie and sees all the lies.
Way to use mean words... -.-;;
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That fat slob, Michael Moore, has decided to give up his oscar nomination for his lying documentary to put it on T.V. before the election. "If Bush loses, that will be my oscar." All this will only hurt Kerry. The Democrats that saw the filth loved it, thinking in their minds it would destroy Bush. LMAO. The half that hated it, the Republicans, knew it was a documentary of garbage and lies. The Democrats feed off fear, but nobody is scared. Kerry is still going to lose. His downward plunge in the polls has got the Liberals furious, but nothing can save him now. I can't wait until everyone sees the movie and sees all the lies.
I really have no interest in seeing such a movie that makes fun of our nation's president either. But you're just being your fundamentalistic self again so once again your opinion I hold with the highest of disregard and unreliability.
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I heard that these to people stood up during it, and started boojng, 'cause it trashed Bush. they are arretsed. I heard on the news that it would be on TV. BUSH RULES!!!!!!!!
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What kind of post was that?
"OMG BUSH R00LZ"
And besides, why is everyone taking that movie so seriously? :blink:
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What kind of post was that?
"OMG BUSH R00LZ"
And besides, why is everyone taking that movie so seriously? :blink:
Cause they can't take life seriously
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people take stuff way too seriously. its a movie made by michael moore. how seriously can you possibly take it?
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Well, i take life seriosly, "HEY LOOK A HUMAN CHIMP!!!!!" But that doesn't mean we cannot have an opinion or would like tom see something, we are interseted, that's all.
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I'm glad it's going to be on TV. I wanted to see it in theaters but I never got to see it. I think it will be funny. Anything against the loser will be great.
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I'm glad it's going to be on TV. I wanted to see it in theaters but I never got to see it. I think it will be funny. Anything against the loser will be great.
I couldn't agree more. I've always wanted to see that movie, but I've never gotten the chance to.
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I think it's beter to see it on TV...less money...make that no money
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Moore was trying to make all the false info out to be true...well, if stupid Dan Rather is willing to put forged documents on t.v., why not the Democrats try and get more lies on T.V.? Liberals go crazy when things don't go there way. If they don't steal the election, like they tried to do in '00, Bush will win by a big landslide. They stole the election from Nixon in 1960 and they won't stop trying to cheat.
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Moore was trying to make all the false info out to be true...well, if stupid Dan Rather is willing to put forged documents on t.v., why not the Democrats try and get more lies on T.V.? Liberals go crazy when things don't go there way. If they don't steal the election, like they tried to do in '00, Bush will win by a big landslide. They stole the election from Nixon in 1960 and they won't stop trying to cheat.
Don't be dissin Dan Rather
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Prove to me it's false.
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I couldn't AGREE ANYMORE MiraclrPlz
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National Security Advisor Condoleeza Rice is depicted in the movie telling a reporter, “Oh, indeed there is a tie between Iraq and what happened on 9/11.”
The scene deceptively shows the Administration directly blaming Saddam and his regime for the attacks on 9/11 by taking her comments out of context. Now read the entire statement made by Ms. Rice to the reporter:
“Oh, indeed there is a tie between Iraq and what happened on 9/11. It’s not that Saddam Hussein was somehow himself and his regime involved in 9/11. But if you think about what caused 9/11, it is the rise of ideologies of hatred that led people to drive airplanes into buildings in New York.” (CBS News, November 28, 2003 Interview)
Fahrenheit Lie #2
In the film, Moore leads viewers to believe that members of bin Laden’s family were allowed to exit the country after the attacks without questioning by authorities. o The September 11th commission, on the other hand, reported that 22 of the 26 people on the flight that took most of the bin Laden family out of the country were interviewed and found to be innocent of suspicion. (Sumana Chatterjee and David Golstein, “Analyzing ‘Fahrenheit 9/11’: It’s Accurate To A Degree,” Seattle Times, 07/05/04)
The commission reported that “each of the flights we have studied was investigated by the FBI and dealt with in a professional manner prior to its departure.”
Fahrenheit Lie #3
Moore claims that James Bath, a friend of President Bush from his time with the Texas Air National Guard, might have funneled bin Laden money to an unsuccessful Bush oil-drilling firm called Arbusto Energy.
Bill Allison, managing editor for the Center for Public Integrity (an independent watchdog group in Washington, D.C.), on the other hand, said, “We looked into bin Laden money going to Arbusto, and we never found anything to back that up,” (Sumana Chatterjee and David Golstein, “Analyzing ‘Fahrenheit 9/11’: It’s Accurate To A Degree,” Seattle Times, 07/05/04)
Fahrenheit Lie #4
The movie claims that the Bush administration “supported closing veterans hospitals.” o “The Department of Veterans Affairs did propose closing seven hospitals in areas with declining populations where the hospitals were underutilized, and whose veterans could be served by other hospitals” (Dave Kopel, Independence Institute, “Fifty-nine Deceits In Fahrenheit 9/11,” http://i2i.org/ (http://i2i.org/) Accessed, 07/11/04)
But Moore’s film fails to mention that the Department also proposed building new hospitals in areas where needs were growing, and also proposed building blind rehabilitation centers and spinal cord injury centers (News Release, Department of Veterans Affairs, www.va.gov, 10/24/03)
Fahrenheit Lie #5
Conspiracy theories abound about the reasons for the War on Terror, but none is more outlandish than the one propagandized in Moore’s film: that the Afghan war was fought solely to enable the Unocal company to build an oil pipeline (the plan for which was abandoned by the company in 1998).
Moore “suggests that one of the first official acts of Afghan President Hamid Karzai … was to help seal a deal for … Unocal to build an oil pipeline from the Caspian Sea through Afghanistan to the Indian Ocean. It alleges that Karzai had been a Unocal consultant.” (emphasis added) (Sumana Chatterjee and David Golstein, “Analyzing ‘Fahrenheit 9/11’: It’s Accurate To A Degree,” Seattle Times, 07/05/04)
Unocal spokesman, Barry Lane, says unequivocally, “Karzai was never, in any capacity, an employee, consultant or a consultant of a consultant,” and Unocal never had a plan to build a Caspian Sea pipeline. (Sumana Chatterjee and David Golstein, “Analyzing ‘Fahrenheit 9/11’: It’s Accurate To A Degree,” Seattle Times, 07/05/04)
Moore mentions that the Taliban visited Texas while President Bush was governor to discuss a potential project with Unocal.
While Moore implies that then-Governor Bush met with the Taliban, no such meeting occurred. The Taliban delegation did, however, meet with the Clinton Administration on this visit. (Matt Labash, “Un-Moored From Reality; Fahrenheit 9/11 Connects Dots That Aren’t There,” Weekly Standard, July 5-July 12 Issue)
Fahrenheit Lie #6
Even readily available figures are exaggerated for effect in Fahrenheit 9/11. The claims have a basis in reality, making them believable, but are false nonetheless. ü In the film, Moore asks Craig Unger, author of House of Bush, House of Saud, “How much money do the Saudis have invested in America, roughly?” to which Unger responds, “Uh, I’ve heard figures as high as $860 billion.”
The Institute for Research: Middle Eastern Policy reports that worldwide Saudi investment approximated $700 billion – a figure much lower than Unger alleges the Saudi government to have invested in the U.S. (Tanya C. Hsu, Institute For Research: Middle Eastern Policy, “The United States Must Not Neglect Saudi Arabian Investment,” www.irmep.org, Accessed 07/11/04)
The Institute reports that 60 percent of that $700 billion – roughly $420 billion, less than half of what Unger “heard” – was actually invested in the United States by the Saudi government.
Fahrenheit Lie #7
“Moore’s film suggests that [President] Bush has close family ties to the bin Laden family – principally through [President] Bush’s father’s relationship with the Carlyle Group, a private investment firm. The president’s father, George H.W. Bush, was a senior adviser to the Carlyle Group’s Asian affiliate until recently; members of the bin Laden family – who own one of Saudi Arabia’s biggest construction firms – had invested $2 million in a Carlyle Group fund. Bush Sr. and the bin Ladens have since severed ties with the Carlyle Group, which in any case has a bipartisan roster of partners, including Bill Clinton’s former SEC chairman Arthur Levitt. The movie quotes author Dan Briody claiming that the Carlyle Group ‘gained’ from September 11 because it owned United Defense, a military contractor. Carlyle Group spokesman Chris Ullman notes that United Defense holds a special distinction among U.S. defense contractors that is not mentioned in Moore’s movie: the firm’s $11 billion Crusader artillery rocket system developed for the U.S. Army is one of the only weapons systems canceled by the Bush administration.” (Dave Kopel, Independence Institute, “Fifty-nine Deceits In Fahrenheit 9/11,” http://i2i.org/ (http://i2i.org/) Accessed, 07/11/04)
“There is another famous investor in Carlyle whom Moore does not reveal: George Soros. But the fact that the anti-Bush billionaire [Soros] has invested in Carlyle would detract from Moore’s simplistic conspiracy theory.” (Dave Kopel, Independence Institute, “Fifty-nine Deceits In Fahrenheit 9/11,” http://i2i.org/ (http://i2i.org/) Accessed, 07/11/04)
Fahrenheit Lie #8
Not revealing relevant facts is dishonest enough. But to paint the Bush Administration as sympathetic and friendly to the Taliban prior to September 11, is not only dishonest, but maliciously so. ü Moore shows film of a March 2001 visit to the United States by a Taliban delegation, claiming that the Administration “welcomed” the Taliban official, Sayed Hashemi, “to tour the United States to help improve the image of the Taliban.”
But the Administration did not welcome the Taliban with open arms. In fact, the State Department rejected the Taliban’s claim that it had complied with U.S. requests to isolate bin Laden.
To demonstrate even further the Administration’s contempt for the Taliban and its illegitimacy, State Department spokesman Richard Boucher – on the day of the terrorist regime’s visit – said, “We don’t recognize any government in Afghanistan.”
Fahrenheit Lie #9
Moore does more than simply downplay the threat posed to the U.S. by the former Hussein regime in Iraq. He goes so far as to assert that Saddam “never threatened to attack the United States.”
If by “attack the United States” one interprets this claim to mean that Saddam never threatened to send troops to the United States, then Mr. Moore has a point. ü But Saddam Hussein clearly sought to attack the United States within his own sphere of influence, even though he didn’t have the resources to attack U.S. soil from his side of the world:
On November 15, 1997, “the main propaganda organ for the Saddam regime, the newspaper Babel (which was run by Saddam Hussein’s son Uday), ordered: ‘American and British interests, embassies, and naval ships in the Arab region should be the targets of military operations and commando attacks by Arab political forces.’” (Dave Kopel, Independence Institute, “Fifty-nine Deceits In Fahrenheit 9/11,” http://i2i.org/ (http://i2i.org/) Accessed, 07/11/04)
In addition, “Iraqi forces fired, every day, for 10 years, on the aircraft that patrolled the no-fly zones and staved off further genocide in the north and south of the country,” (Source: New York Times, 12/1/03).
Saddam Hussein also provided safe haven to terrorists who killed Americans, like Abu Nidal; funded suicide bombers in Israel who certainly killed Americans; and ran the Iraqi police, which plotted to assassinate former President George Bush.
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Eh...have you figured out that no one really listens to you anymore?
Although I still see Bush winning
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They are scared of the truth. Just join the right side. I've proved it all false.
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Yes, Moore has a biased view and is trying to sway people over to vote Liberal. But do you honestly think that Bush is telling you the truth and hasn't lied to you once? Do you really believe that?
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They are scared of the truth. Just join the right side. I've proved it all false.
Just join the right side...IZ and ps2k3
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Yes, Moore has a biased view and is trying to sway people over to vote Liberal. But do you honestly think that Bush is telling you the truth and hasn't lied to you once? Do you really believe that?
Notice how no one is responding to that post about why F9/11 is false.
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Yes, Moore has a biased view and is trying to sway people over to vote Liberal. But do you honestly think that Bush is telling you the truth and hasn't lied to you once? Do you really believe that?
Notice how no one is responding to that post about why F9/11 is false.
They changed the title...which made the original person who made it...POed
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Why no one is? Because it's too long and I honestly don't feel like reading the whole thing. I mean, if it were something on how Kurt Cobain DID commit suicide, I'd read it and then thrash you to pieces with enough proof to make any self respecting middle aged music teacher believe. But to read all that boring stuff? Keep dreaming. And I know you didnt write it...otherwise you wouldn't have links in it. Your not worth my time. I'm gonna go look at some eggs now.
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Than don't read it. Liberals just have to live in their own fantasy world and even when the truth is staring them in the face, forget it. I don't give a dolphin sound!!!
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Than don't read it. Liberals just have to live in their own fantasy world and even when the truth is staring them in the face, forget it. I don't give a dolphin sound!!!
Dude...just drop it. IZ is right and you know it
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Im not Liberal. I'm not Conservative. I'm Green...careful what you say sweety, people might get mad...
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So are you for Nader? Please, get all your Democrat friends to support Nader. heh. I may be the only person here not brainwashed by Liberal parents. My parents warned me about how evil they are. About how they feed off fear and hate us so much and hear what they want to hear all of the time. But I am saved. If your parents try to make you Liberal, don't listen to them. Be your own man.
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First I'm female, second I'm Canadian, third, my parents are liberal so BACK OFF.
Pause for a second and pretend that You aren't ALWAYS RIGHT. Maybe, just maybe, being conservative isn't THE RIGHT SIDE. You aren't the only human on this Earth. Others need their needs met as well.
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Quit being a jerk MSP. You think you win debates alot and will get everyone to be on your side but it's NOT GONNA HAPPEN. Sorry for yelling but I'm really tired of MSP being this way.
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I may be the only person here not brainwashed by Liberal parents. My parents warned me about how evil they are. About how they feed off fear and hate us so much and hear what they want to hear all of the time. But I am saved.
Sounds like you were brainwashed by Conservative parents instead.
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I may be the only person here not brainwashed by Liberal parents. My parents warned me about how evil they are. About how they feed off fear and hate us so much and hear what they want to hear all of the time. But I am saved.
Sounds like you were brainwashed by Conservative parents instead.
100% denied
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If I was brainwashed by Conservative parents, I'm glad because they're right. I have good evidence to back all of my arguments. But everyone's too lazy to read it so they flame me for being right.
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I don't care...anything so Bush dosen't win!
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If I was brainwashed by Conservative parents, I'm glad because they're right. I have good evidence to back all of my arguments. But everyone's too lazy to read it so they flame me for being right.
And others have proof that Liberals are right, but instead of properly debating them, you go on a tirade of cuss words and telling them that YOU'RE right and THEY'RE wrong. Maybe you're just getting a taste of your own medicine.
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Liberals are right?! Alot of them don't like to even be called Liberals because it clearly defines all the sick things they stand for, from free welfare to taking away gun rights to controlling our lives to taking all rights and to murder of babies, something called, I dunno, "abortion" Most prefer the term "progressivists," which is another word for Socialism.
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Liberals are right?! Alot of them don't like to even be called Liberals because it clearly defines all the sick things they stand for, from free welfare to taking away gun rights to controlling our lives to taking all rights and to murder of babies, something called, I dunno, "abortion" Most prefer the term "progressivists," which is another word for Socialism.
If you ever come to Canada and talk like that in my town you're gonna get your but kicked. YOU don't know the PRO side of being Liberal. All you know is the CON side. And perosnally, free health care...sounds friggin good to me. And abortion is a very controversial topic. Who ever said you were right? Who ever said I was right? And free welfare. Okay. If you'd rather have a bum living in the doorway of your apartment, by all means, invite one to live there. Taking away gun rights. GOOD!! the USA is one of the most violent countries.
All I'm trying to say is LOOK AT THE OTHER PERSON'S POINT OF VIEW. That's the ONLY way you'll EVER win a debate. Trust me. I know. I've debated genetical engineering, on the pro side, and amazingly I won. I've debated globalization, on the PRO side and again won. How? Becuase I looked at both sides. Pro and Con. Otherwise, the other team is totally gonna kick your butt, and youll be left with your jaw hanging open wondering what in the world happened.
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Liberals are right?! Alot of them don't like to even be called Liberals because it clearly defines all the sick things they stand for, from free welfare to taking away gun rights to controlling our lives to taking all rights and to murder of babies, something called, I dunno, "abortion" Most prefer the term "progressivists," which is another word for Socialism.
If you ever come to Canada and talk like that in my town you're gonna get your but kicked. YOU don't know the PRO side of being Liberal. All you know is the CON side. And perosnally, free health care...sounds friggin good to me. And abortion is a very controversial topic. Who ever said you were right? Who ever said I was right? And free welfare. Okay. If you'd rather have a bum living in the doorway of your apartment, by all means, invite one to live there. Taking away gun rights. GOOD!! the USA is one of the most violent countries.
All I'm trying to say is LOOK AT THE OTHER PERSON'S POINT OF VIEW. That's the ONLY way you'll EVER win a debate. Trust me. I know. I've debated genetical engineering, on the pro side, and amazingly I won. I've debated globalization, on the PRO side and again won. How? Becuase I looked at both sides. Pro and Con. Otherwise, the other team is totally gonna kick your butt, and youll be left with your jaw hanging open wondering what in the world happened.
I know Canada is Socialist.
Free health care- not bad, but it is stolen from people who work for a living's profits! Tax! No way man! Communism. That's basically what they are.
Abortion- DO NOT get me started.
Gun rights- it's in the friggen CONSTITUTIN! It is a right that no one is taking away. If guns kill people,blame your typewriter for mispelkling words on your pc. Guns don't kill people. Abortion clinics kill people.
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Man, I hope your poor one day and are in an accident. No free health care for you. So, now you're calling me a communist? A Communist? Do you even know what a REAL communist is? DO YOU? Cuz, you know, Canada has rich people and poor people and in between people. If you ask me, the US and their Big Brother are already on their way to becoming a totalitarian society. You wanna insult other countries because they care for ALL their people? Wow. Stay in the US. Get a job at McDonalds for the rest of your life, and continue whining for all I care.
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I know, if Kerry is elected, this country will be on the road to Totalitarianism. Liberals trying to make it illegal to serve eggs over easy in restaraunts in NJ? That is complete Totalitarianism. And it is true. You can look it up on the internet. I was in the state during the protests. I'm not calling you a Communist, CFA.
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Man, I hope your poor one day and are in an accident.
Thanks for being so concerning!
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I'm upper middle class. I can never be poor. The poor should go to work. This is America. This is the land of opportunity!!! I'm not getting an idiot President that will raise our taxes and give it to the ever "helpless" poor in this country! Welfare=stealing money from good, clean, honest citizens and giving it to undesrving bums.
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I know, if Kerry is elected, this country will be on the road to Totalitarianism. Liberals trying to make it illegal to serve eggs over easy in restaraunts in NJ? That is complete Totalitarianism. And it is true. You can look it up on the internet. I was in the state during the protests. I'm not calling you a Communist, CFA.
I'm Canadian, you're saying we're Commies because we have free health care.
oh and SSJ, I'm saying that because it puts things in persepctive. If you are poor, and get run over by a car, it's not gonna cost you the arm and leg that they fix to pay for it.
And Bush has already started it by taking away your privacy with his Patriot Act. He can get people to go into your house, and snoop around without having to tell you. The only reason you don't know, is because no one with an IQ lower that 150 can read the Act, it's so full of legal mumbojumbo.
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I'm upper middle class. I can never be poor. The poor should go to work. This is America. This is the land of opportunity!!! I'm not getting an idiot President that will raise our taxes and give it to the ever "helpless" poor in this country! Welfare=stealing money from good, clean, honest citizens and giving it to undesrving bums.
Gah, Americans don't get that, WE NEED TAXES UP.
The country is in 7 billion dollars in debt and Kerry wants us to get back on track.
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I've determined that it's pointless to debate with MSP...don't try and make him see Liberals aren't as bad as his parents think.
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I would be happy if we became more socialist. It almost happened with Clinton's health care plan back in '92, but that failed. Anyway, I agree. Debating with MSP is like debating with a brick wall.
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which is why I have the solution for everything! Vote Oprah!! She'American, and she loves the people and truly wants to help them. If she ran for office, I'd move to the States, just to be able to register to vote and I'd vote for her.
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You say "look att he other side." I don't care about the other side. Liberals say they want equality for all, but they hate all people who don't agree with them. "C'mon man, you know in your heart were right, man!" man, man, hippie man blah blah. I hate, I mean HATE everything that the Liberal Democrats stand for. So I'm not going to 'bring up the other side.' yes, it's 'biased', so is you.
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actually, I'm green...again, how many times do I gotta say that? and when you say that liberals say that they know they're right, etc, well, so do the conservatives. ALL parties do that. And I'm telling you to look at the other side, because that's what makes a good debater a GOOD debater. Heck, if Michael Moore (whom you so do hate) can do it, why can't you? (and yes he does...I read Dude, Where's My Country and he gives both sides)
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actually, I'm green...again, how many times do I gotta say that?
Only once...I think we got it the first time :)
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You guys do, but MSP doesn't!! He's doing it on TWO message boards...he thinks I'm Liberal!!!
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You guys do, but MSP doesn't!! He's doing it on TWO message boards...he thinks I'm Liberal!!!
The right thing to do is just ignore him...I do it all the time :)
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I'm Liberal, and proud of it. :biggrin: Bring it on, MSP! You're lost in a fussion of facts and numbers; you don't give a crap about abstracts and possibilities.
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You don't support abortion so I wouldn't know you were Liberal at first glance.
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I'm big on morality and ethics. :cool: