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Off Topic => Everything Else => Debate Den => Topic started by: carterhawk on July 11, 2006, 02:25:34 am
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The poll above used to read: Would jesus be ok with Crosses everywhere, the choices in order were No, Maybe, Yes.
Just curious what yall think. i understand the "Jesus died for your sins" part, but not the "say thanks by putting up crosses everywhere" thing. Personaly, if i came back to life, after being murdered, i would not want to be surround by representations of whatever killed me.
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Crosses are more of a reminder of why Jesus died, not how He died.
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to humans maybe, but this is from jesus' point of view.
When someones is killed in a drive by shooting, the mourners dont wear guns around their necks.
oh, and vote in the poll, thats why the poll is there.
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well they way you worded it it makes your point of opinion look right. which is not fair and wrong. Jesus wants us to remeber what he did for us and wearing a cross is a symbol of that. its a constant reminder of what he did for humanity.
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Yeah, if somebody was shot their family's don't walk around asking people to destroy all guns...
It's a reminder, so people know what he went through for us.
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This is the dumbest topic you've ever made in the debate den.
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SSJ, next time your in town ill shove you in with the tigers at the zoo, see if you dont develop a fear of them after a couple of days.
Look at it the question this way, would jesus want everyone having symbols of death and torture all over the place? seems to contradict that whole message of love and peace. its not like crucifiction was special for jesus or anything. it was the electric chair of hte old days.
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its a symbol for remembering His sacrifice...plain and simple. He knew exactly wut He was doing and He wants people to remember wut He did and wut He did it for. Jesus Christ is not gonna have some phobia of crosses.
the Son of God isnt gonna come and go "OH SNAP, A CROSS!! GET IT AWAY FROM ME!!!11"
no.
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I dunno how he would react. I never met the guy. What I'm saying is that I can't really speak for him. (Not that he doesn't exist[He might, might not.])
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@loco:
i asked what do you think jesus would do, not what he would do.
Either A: You have a time machine and have seen the second coming, B: You speak for Jesus or C: You didnt understand the question
It is however, quite doubtfull that Jesus would behave in such an undignified manner. i would think that he would most likely, in expressing his possible disdain for the symbol, politely ask for them to be taken down. I dont know what church you go to that quotes Jesus as ever saying or even possibly saying "Oh Snap" or anything like it. By the way, "wut" isnt a word. At least try to show some respect for the language.
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@loco:
i asked what do you think jesus would do, not what he would do.
There is no difference there mate. Whatever you say He would do is obviously what you think He would do.
On another note, you may want to fix your own grammar and punctuation errors before criticizing someone else's spelling errors...
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Elizabeth rose eats beatles with garlic sauce.
I think Elizabeth rose eats beatles with garlic sauce.
Two words make all the difference.
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you asked a question in the poll...so it should then be implied that my response is what i think. aside from that, stfu with your stupid technicalities.
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Elizabeth rose eats beatles with garlic sauce.
I think Elizabeth rose eats beatles with garlic sauce.
Two words make all the difference.
This poll wasn't set up that way. When a question is asked, every answer is an "I think", so stfu already.
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there, i cleared it up for the obvious impaired.
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the "obvious impared"? you're the one who's obvious impared, by not figuring out that what someone says in response to a question is what they think of it.
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Im not asking what you think of the question, im asking WDYTJWD.
keeping on topic, is there any biblical source quoting jesus as wanting the cross to be his symbol?
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the Bible says to remember the sacrifice Jesus made...the cross is one of the symbols used to help us do that.
as for your little question...is there any biblical source of Jesus NOT wanting the cross to be a symbol? no. why do i T-H-I-N-K Jesus isnt bothered by the cross? because physical death is a small step in a much bigger picture...and Jesus went through it willingly. if Jesus was so afraid of physical death, he wouldnt have died. He wasnt afraid of death in life as a man...and it really aint gonna bother Him as the divine one who cant DIE at all. bottom line...my opinion...what i THINK. what i BELIEVE. what i know to be true. got some other technicality you wanna throw at me? i aint listening cuz i made my point. got a problem with that? tough toasties...i dont care. believe what you want.
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So jesus has no emotions? it is impossible that being in human form, in a human body, his human mind just might be overwhelmed by the experience?
And dont throw my question back at me, just admit that there *isnt* any place in the bible saying jesus is in favor of crosses being used as his symbol. i probably would have voted for a loaf of bread or a fish or something to symbolize generosity and kindness, if i were on the commity that picked the cross. if the only reason for the cross is to remember why he died, why not use a symbol representing humanity or salvation, instead of using his method of death.
If they had hanged, drawn and quartered him, would churches have nooses atop them?
If they had burned him at the stake would there be flames around peoples necks?
No one said jesus was afraid of physical death either, only that it is possible that the experience might have left deep psychological wounds. However, if you read Matthew 27:46, he doesnt sound any too pleased about dying either.
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So jesus has no emotions? it is impossible that being in human form, in a human body, his human mind just might be overwhelmed by the experience?
He's no longer in human form...your point fails.
And dont throw my question back at me
well i did. dont like it? i dont care.
No one said jesus was afraid of physical death either, only that it is possible that the experience might have left deep psychological wounds. However, if you read Matthew 27:46, he doesnt sound any too pleased about dying either.
no one likes dying...but like i said. He wasnt afraid. He didnt and still doesnt have the fragile mind that men have. the Son of God is never going to be "psychologically wounded" by anything.
disclaimer: everything i said above is what i think and believe, so shut your face about it.
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So jesus has no emotions? it is impossible that being in human form, in a human body, his human mind just might be overwhelmed by the experience?
He's no longer in human form...your point fails.
I think he meannt upon a second coming
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yup. second coming, not right now. besides, didnt he *suffer* for our sins? if he didnt suffer and isnt still suffering, then what was the point?
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yea, He suffered and He died for our sins. i never said He didnt suffer as a man, buts thats besides my whole point. Jesus can't die anymore cuz He's no longer a man. if you were incapable of being physically harmed by anything, what reason would you have to fear anything at all? well then you say He could've been emotionally or psychologically wounded by the experience...once again, He doesnt have the fragile mind we have. and no, i'm not sayin He doesnt have emotions, but there's no reason to fear or look down upon a symbol of something that cant harm you. it's just how some people remember His death, and i dont think it'll bother Him...period.
review time...
died willingly as a man
+divine being
+cant die anymore
+cant be hurt anymore
+no fragile mind
+wants us to remember His death
no reason to fear or hate crosses
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All seeing Eye your an idiot. no offence...
Jesus died for us. He knew it since the day he was born. It was Gods plan. God plans everything. Why dont you take a look in YOUR bible?? God has everything planned out. Our God is a loving God, a caring God, and he risked his only son for all of evil humanity so God could help our greedy souls. We dont even deserve that. He risked his only sons life for us. Thats amazing. Of course Jesus would not be afriad of crosses. God plans everything that will happen before, during and after the second comming of CHrist. Which is not far off. The war between two nations in the middle east from revalations is happeneing. That is one of the last steps. The mark of the beast which is the computer chip that either goes into your forehead or hand. Thats where the mark of the beast goes. It scans you for information, and they have already come out with that! There will be many storms and the Earth shall shake and crumble. God is giving us signs that he is coming for us soon. The anti christ is NOT far off from taking over.
He wants us to remember that he died for us, what he did for us was amazing. He is not scared of crosses. He looks at them as a sign of triumph and pride because of waht he did to help save humanity..which is going down the drain anyways. He is not afraid of crosses.
And I just dont THINK that, I KNOW that.He came to me in a dream, and showed me whats going to happen. No arguments against crosses. Theres nothing you can argue.
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All seeing Eye your an idiot. no offence...
Jesus died for us. He knew it since the day he was born. It was Gods plan. God plans everything.
God has everything planned out.
This denies free will, thus all actions anyone takes are pre-ordained. I am not guilty of sinning for god wanted me to sin?
Our God is a loving God, a caring God
He is neither. He is a petty and jealous god, for those who do not follow him will suffer eternal damnation. That is about 4,000,000,000 to 5,000,000,000 people every hundred years, and rising.
he risked his only son for all of evil humanity so God could help our greedy souls ... He risked his only sons life for us.
His son died and knew he would die, and after he died went straight to heaven, there was no risk involved.
The war between two nations in the middle east from revalations is happeneing.
War in the middle east has been happening for as long as people have lived there, this is nothing new.
The mark of the beast which is the computer chip that either goes into your forehead or hand. Thats where the mark of the beast goes. It scans you for information, and they have already come out with that!
Please, do not ever have children or adopt. And add some more tinfoil to your hat there.
There will be many storms and the Earth shall shake and crumble.
The earth is always shaking and crumbling, and there have been a great many quakes and major volcanic eruptions for as long as man has existed. There is a photo somewhere of a collapsed double decker freeway...
God is giving us signs that he is coming for us soon.
Good, i have a great many questions for him.
The anti christ is NOT far off from taking over.
So then god is powerless against the anti christ? When the end of the world occurs, what purpose does Hell serve? if all who will ever be sent to hell are there, why allow them to continue suffering? a Kind and Caring god would put us poor wreches out of our misery, rather than allow us to suffer. The mortal men who founded our fine country saw fit to forbid Cruel and Unusual punishment, why hasn't God?
He wants us to remember that he died for us, what he did for us was amazing. He is not scared of crosses. He looks at them as a sign of triumph and pride because of waht he did to help save humanity..which is going down the drain anyways. He is not afraid of crosses.
Care to give a little more insight into that assertion? the cross was only one method of execution, it would have been just as easy to have hanged him, or chopped off his head at the block. no, the cross was the most agonizing and *humiliating* form of capital punishment, though it was hardly special for jesus.
And I just dont THINK that, I KNOW that.He came to me in a dream, and showed me whats going to happen. No arguments against crosses. Theres nothing you can argue.
If the second coming of Christ is supposed to be the very next time he appears on earth since his death some 2000 years ago, whatever you saw in your dream couldnt have been him, right?
@loco:
I understand remembering his death, but who decided to use the cross? was jesus in any way involved in the aproval of the cross? how long after his death was it until his followers started using the cross? If the important part of having a symbol for jesus is remembering him and his sacrifice, are there not more friendly symbols available?
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All seeing Eye your an idiot. no offence...
Jesus died for us. He knew it since the day he was born. It was Gods plan. God plans everything.
God has everything planned out.
This denies free will, thus all actions anyone takes are pre-ordained. I am not guilty of sinning for god wanted me to sin?
Our God is a loving God, a caring God
He is neither. He is a petty and jealous god, for those who do not follow him will suffer eternal damnation. That is about 4,000,000,000 to 5,000,000,000 people every hundred years, and rising.
he risked his only son for all of evil humanity so God could help our greedy souls ... He risked his only sons life for us.
His son died and knew he would die, and after he died went straight to heaven, there was no risk involved.
The war between two nations in the middle east from revalations is happeneing.
War in the middle east has been happening for as long as people have lived there, this is nothing new.
The mark of the beast which is the computer chip that either goes into your forehead or hand. Thats where the mark of the beast goes. It scans you for information, and they have already come out with that!
Please, do not ever have children or adopt. And add some more tinfoil to your hat there.
There will be many storms and the Earth shall shake and crumble.
The earth is always shaking and crumbling, and there have been a great many quakes and major volcanic eruptions for as long as man has existed. There is a photo somewhere of a collapsed double decker freeway...
God is giving us signs that he is coming for us soon.
Good, i have a great many questions for him.
The anti christ is NOT far off from taking over.
So then god is powerless against the anti christ? When the end of the world occurs, what purpose does Hell serve? if all who will ever be sent to hell are there, why allow them to continue suffering? a Kind and Caring god would put us poor wreches out of our misery, rather than allow us to suffer. The mortal men who founded our fine country saw fit to forbid Cruel and Unusual punishment, why hasn't God?
He wants us to remember that he died for us, what he did for us was amazing. He is not scared of crosses. He looks at them as a sign of triumph and pride because of waht he did to help save humanity..which is going down the drain anyways. He is not afraid of crosses.
Care to give a little more insight into that assertion? the cross was only one method of execution, it would have been just as easy to have hanged him, or chopped off his head at the block. no, the cross was the most agonizing and *humiliating* form of capital punishment, though it was hardly special for jesus.
And I just dont THINK that, I KNOW that.He came to me in a dream, and showed me whats going to happen. No arguments against crosses. Theres nothing you can argue.
If the second coming of Christ is supposed to be the very next time he appears on earth since his death some 2000 years ago, whatever you saw in your dream couldnt have been him, right?
@loco:
I understand remembering his death, but who decided to use the cross? was jesus in any way involved in the aproval of the cross? how long after his death was it until his followers started using the cross? If the important part of having a symbol for jesus is remembering him and his sacrifice, are there not more friendly symbols available?
No, your a freaking idiot. *No Offence*
And for your information i am adopting when i am older. Because I am right with whats happening I am an idiot. I dont think so.
His last coming was about 2,000 years ago, and hes soon to come again. Why would he come to me in a dream and tell me and show me all thas going to happen, when i didnt even believe in him? tell me moron.
I learned that what my dream was about was exactly what was in the bible. I never even knew it.
The EArth that CRUMBLES AND SHAKES, of course it does all the time moron. The bible says major storms and earthquakes will happen. And Our God isnt only a jealous God. HE cares and loves, and he gives us many chances in life, so dont be going around saying he isnt friendly and doesnt care.
God knows everything. Dont even argue that. He knows what you are thinking, doing, and anything else.
And crosses are the symbols that we carry around close to us to represent how much we truly appreciate and care that he DIED for us. He did it willingly. He knew what was going to happen.
Jesus is the son of God, and He is also one with God. God had Jesus die on that cross for all of us.
And It doesnt matter if he went straight to heaven. He went through much pain, agony, and humiliation.
And the wars between the two countries in the middle east? It doesnt happen ALL the time, you are saying that every week, every month, or every day there are two countries from there at war. THat is false, NOT true.
The fact that all the other events in revalations are taking place, this just adds to the list. BEcause Isreal, the holy land, is going to war. Not just some other regular old country.
Somewhere over there the anti christ is there. HE is the leader of one of the countries. I have a feeling Jesus will come during my lifetime. He told me there isnt much time left in my dream, and to spread the word. In one way I am a prophet. I dont want to be, but i am....and i doubt im one of the seven prophets, but who knows.
And as for the crosses, wtf do you mean are there any more friendly symbols available? Do you thik a peice of bread symbolizes what he did for us? What he went through for us? Of course not. Do you think a fish and a loaf of bread symbolizes what he did for us. It will never be enough.
The cross is the only symbol that keeps us reminded what he did. If he did not want man to make crosses he would have said so. But there is not anything in the bible that says " DO NOT make crosses"
So obviously God wants us to be reminded of what happened, and to wear it with pride knowing your God did that for you, and you appreciate so much what he did that your wearing the cross with pride.
As for you, you sound like msp, cut it out.
Lord knows we dont need another MSP.
And The good followers of God will be saved, the others who dont believe shall live on The planet while the anti christ is ruling.
And No they dont have to go to hell if they are LEFT BEHIND, they can make it up and start following him during that rough time, and deny to worship the anti christ, like what is supposed to happen, and deny him saying "no you arent greater than god, you are not more powerful, your not more holy. He will kill you of course, but God will let you come to heaven.
Thats your last chance to get to heaven. He gives us many chances in life. He is a kind, caring, strict God, which makes him all around perfect.
EDIT: I see what my mom says about me being a lawyer....id make a good lawyer... :P
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No, your a freaking idiot. *No Offence*
Is that sarcasm or are you actualy trying to not offend me while using an offensive phrase?
And for your information i am adopting when i am older.
Please dont, we don't need more paranoid conspiracy theorists.
Because I am right with whats happening
And whats happening?
I am an idiot.
Agreed
His last coming was about 2,000 years ago, and hes soon to come again. Why would he come to me in a dream and tell me and show me all thas going to happen, when i didnt even believe in him?
So you don't believe in him? I think you misunderstood the question. Christ is supposed to not return until his Second Coming, so your dream is either the Second Coming of Christ, or the imaginings of your brain.
tell me moron.
name calling again, eh?
I learned that what my dream was about was exactly what was in the bible. I never even knew it.
So you never knew anything about christianity before your dream? Ever seen Donnie Darko? Its a movie about a rather emotionaly disturbed young man whoes friend frank fortells the end times.
The EArth that CRUMBLES AND SHAKES, of course it does all the time
So if it shakes and crumbles all the time, how is that a sign of the end of the world?
moron.
Time to invest in a thesaurus mate.
The bible says major storms and earthquakes will happen.
The Gavelston hurricane of 1900 brought great death and destruction comparable to katrina, as did the 1906 quake in San Fransisco. If storms and quakes are a sign of christ coming, he is 100 years late, at a minium.
And Our God isnt only a jealous God. HE cares and loves, and he gives us many chances in life, so dont be going around saying he isnt friendly and doesnt care.
Life vs Eternity, we are given but a fraction of our total existance in life and death to follow your god. For your god to say a child rapist and an islamic nun are equal and send them both to hell for not accepting christ is evil.
God knows everything. Dont even argue that. He knows what you are thinking, doing, and anything else.
Duh. Im not arguing against that, im arguing against divination. For God to know all that is to happen means that free will does not exist. Again, because God has decided all the actions I will ever take for me, I am incable of sin.
And crosses are the symbols that we carry around close to us to represent how much we truly appreciate and care that he DIED for us. He did it willingly. He knew what was going to happen.
He knew it was going to happen because it was god's will right? Then god killed his own son?
Jesus is the son of God, and He is also one with God. God had Jesus die on that cross for all of us.
Why? Could not god himself have simple come to earth and told us how he wished things to be?
And It doesnt matter if he went straight to heaven. He went through much pain, agony, and humiliation.
But hardly enough to atone for all the sins of every human that would ever exist.
And the wars between the two countries in the middle east? It doesnt happen ALL the time, you are saying that every week, every month, or every day there are two countries from there at war. THat is false, NOT true.
While the last 60 years have been filled with high tension conflict, there were wars and agressions going back as far as Sumer and earlier.
The fact that all the other events in revalations are taking place, this just adds to the list. BEcause Isreal, the holy land, is going to war. Not just some other regular old country.
Israel was founded by war, and has been the subject of war for 60 years
Somewhere over there the anti christ is there. HE is the leader of one of the countries.
Some would say the same of Bush :p
I have a feeling Jesus will come during my lifetime. He told me there isnt much time left in my dream, and to spread the word. In one way I am a prophet. I dont want to be, but i am....and i doubt im one of the seven prophets, but who knows.
Perhaps you are a false prophet, your dream a message from satan, ment to lead the faithful astray. Hell, you could be the Anti Christ for all anyone knows. To put stock in dreams is to step into madness.
And as for the crosses, wtf do you mean are there any more friendly symbols available? Do you thik a peice of bread symbolizes what he did for us? What he went through for us? Of course not. Do you think a fish and a loaf of bread symbolizes what he did for us. It will never be enough.
When christianity started, the cross was a symbol of death and torture, like the guillotine and the noose. It took a long time after that for it to be accepted and recognized as the symbol of the church.
The cross is the only symbol that keeps us reminded what he did. If he did not want man to make crosses he would have said so. But there is not anything in the bible that says " DO NOT make crosses"
The bible was written years after jesus died. I would put far more stock in it if the bible had come straight from God without middle men.
So obviously God wants us to be reminded of what happened, and to wear it with pride knowing your God did that for you, and you appreciate so much what he did that your wearing the cross with pride.
Millions of jews were killed by the nazis. We dont go around wearing swastikas to remember their sacrifice.
As for you, you sound like msp, cut it out.
Lord knows we dont need another MSP.
Never met him. If you cant handle someone who dissagrees with you, stay out of the thread.
And The good followers of God will be saved, the others who dont believe shall live on The planet while the anti christ is ruling.
And No they dont have to go to hell if they are LEFT BEHIND, they can make it up and start following him during that rough time, and deny to worship the anti christ, like what is supposed to happen, and deny him saying "no you arent greater than god, you are not more powerful, your not more holy. He will kill you of course, but God will let you come to heaven.
If god loves and is caring, he would not allow the Anti Christ to rule. If god is all knowing then he wouldnt need to test humans, he would know from the moment they are concieved if they are worthy of heaven.
Thats your last chance to get to heaven. He gives us many chances in life.
You cant have it both ways.
He is a kind, caring, strict God, which makes him all around perfect.
God punishes those who do not follow him with eternal damnation and suffering, thats way beyond strict. No man on earth has ever been so cruel.
EDIT: I see what my mom says about me being a lawyer....id make a good lawyer...
You would have been thrown out for contempt of court just based on how many times you resorted to name calling.
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Ok msp, maybe you should read the whole sentence next time. The fact that everything that was in my dream is in the bibel, a bit ironic being the faact that i didnt even know about it. And God is coming back, I know it.
I am adopting. YOu shouldnt get married, id feel bad for your future husband, i mean wife..
The earth shakes and crumbles MORE VIOLENTLY now. Quote the rest of the sentence, dont pull bits and peices.
Your an idiot, your right.
YEs i believe in him. He is coming again, I suppose if you dont believe it you wont be saved. Have fun on EArth with the anti christ. :)
God didnt kill his own son. Man did. He knew it was goign to happen though. It was Gods plan.
And sp your saying that him dieing on the cross isnt enough for all of humanity? God did. I guess your the one who doesn't believe.
Whats happening is the end times. Revalation.
He is not late, there are way to many signs that are the same thing as the bible that is going on at the same time.
Maybe Bush is the anti christ, none of us know.
See , you are in a life of sin. God didnt come to me for no reason. The anti christ did not give me that dream. perhaps i should post my dream...maybe you would be able to understand better, although i highly doubt it. I am not arguing anymore about this. I believe in God, I believe everything He has done, what He has shown me and told me in dreams. Your acting much more like the anti christ in this topic.
Ill post my dream again. Although small minds cant function with reading such true and story length material.
And did you notice that everyone in this topic is agaisnt you? Have you realized that?
You are the only one who thinks the absolutley insane idea. God is not afraid of crosses, neither is Jesus.
Here is my dream.
I had a dream and jesus came to me. And told me the antichrist is coming soon.
And to trust him and he took me to the future of what the world was going to be like when and after he came and the people left behind who didnt go to heaven.
And everything was burned to the ground, there was no buildings and no food or water or anything. Just bombs and guns and dead body parts blown apart everywhere.
And he told me to trust him, and give myself to him and just follow what he's saying and that i shouldnt be scared.
And he told me to just trust him ad do what he says, and i wont end up there.
And he told me the antichrist is coming soon and he doesnt want me left behind with him (the anti christ)
And he told me to spread the word, which is why i'm doing this now, to help you guys.
It was just..amazing... i saw him..i was just..i dont know
He was just so awesome standing there next to me, just..so heavenly, glorius...i cant explain it...he wanted me to spread the word.
But it was so real, he took me to the future while the anti chrsit was ruling, it was just horrible..i mean i have heard he comes to the people who have doubt, like me, and i just really..wow..just amazing!
Im doing everything he told me in the dream, and so far things are getting better!
Because im trusting my life to him, and im not scared or anything, and don't have doubts like before.
And he looked like all the pictures of him described and painted, except better!
But he just had this unearthly and amazing glow to him...he wore like a glowing white older outfit that you see alot back when he was alive , but his was just, like, i dont know..
Unexplainable, and indescribeable!
He told me he'd made sure i made it to heaven if i just follow him and do what he told me, and to spread the word of what he's said to me!
The future with the anti chrsit was just, i dont know, horrible, scary...there were dead bodies and body parts blown everywhere..
But he told me theres NOT HARDLY ANY TIME LEFT BEFORE THE ANTI CHRIST IS ON EARTH, but i dont know if he ment born or take over, he wouldnt tell me.
I just needed to spread it, like he said, i believe in him more than ever now.
Iasked him , "Why did you come to me, outta all of the people, im no one special and important"
But he put his hand on my shoulder and told me im important as everyone else is. I could feel him touch me, it was insane feeling, and i was sleeping, you can't feel things like that if your asleep..
It was just warm, glowy, unexplainable feeling, i dont know, incredible.. like nothing ever before...
I told him i felt ashamed standing in his presence, because i was sinful and he was just so holy!
But he told me he'd repent my sins right there and then if i wanted. And of course i said yes.
But i dont know, it was the greatest experirence ever. When he came to me i just automaticly bowed before him. Just his presence being there with him was incredible.I dont know, it was just, amazing..
He showed me the gates of heaven but wouldnt let go in, just view it everything was gold.
I asked him directly, why did you choose me father, why didnt you choose the pope or someone important? All he said was that i was just as important as the pope.
Well i just asked him..he kinda laughed at me, but i didnt question why he laughed when i said the pope.......
It was the best experience ever though, it was just..just real..
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THE FUTURE WHAT IT WAS LIKE, PLEASE AT LEAST DONT SKIP THIS! PLEASE THE MOST *IMPORTANT* PART! ABOUT THE ANTICHRIST AND HOW TO GET TO HEAVEN!
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I was dreaming about school too and all of the sudden the dream gets cut off and Jesus comes.
We first start out in a desert area, common day, and he takes me to the future where buildings and cities are supposed to be.
And everything is burning and ashes and red, blood red satanic colored stuff....and the sand! blood red too!
And Jesus told me not to be afraid, and he was just showing me what it was like, i trusted him and he stood close to me.There was just..I don't know, everything was horrible!
Dead bodies, bombs, body parts just everywhere, and i asked why am i here, he told me that this is what the anti chrsit will be doing and what will happen when he takes control.
It was just...too violent and graphic to explain really..
Jesus didnt tell me when the anti christ was coming, who he was or where he was, he just told me he'd be coming to this earth soon. He kept telling me to SPREAD THE WORD, he wants to save and get as many people to heaven as he can beofre IT'S TOO LATE. He didnt want them to be left for the anti christ to torcher and have them suffer.
He told me not to worry about when the anti christ came, just liive my life and enjoy it and SPREAD THE WORD and he would watch over me.
................................................................................................... .....
****TO GET TO HEAVEN***
................................................................................................... .....
He told me to get to heaven, accept him as your lord and savior, to accept him as your God, and accept that he IS THE SON OF GOD, HE IS GOD. TO NOT SIN, TO BELIVE HE IS THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD. TO NOT BE AFRAID OF THE ANTI CHRIST, BUT TO TRUST JESUS AND GOD AND EVERYTHING WILL BE OK.
AND ANYONE WHO BELIEVES AND WHAT HE IS SAYING AND THE THINGS HE TOLD ME TO GET TO HEAVEN, WILL GO TO HEAVEN. ANYONE WHO DOESN'T BELIEVE WILL BE LEFT FOR THE ANTI CHRIST. THEY WILL NEVER GO TO HEAVEN IF THEY DON'T TRUST WHAT JESUS SAID, IF THEY DON'T ACCEPT HIM. If you do want to go to heaven , do what he told me to do and have everyone else do the same. And most importantly, like he said
*****SPREAD THE WORD*****
................................................................................................... .....
THIS IS A TRUE AND REAL STORY OF WHAT HAPPENED TO ME LAST NIGHT. JESUS CAME TO ME, HE TOLD ME HE WANTS TO SAVE AS MANY PEOPLE AS HE CAN, SO PLEASE SPREAD THE WORD, HE DOESN'T WANT ANYONE LEFT BEHIND.
Please if you belive all these things that happened to me last night then please, PLEASE ,PLEASE repost thiis to spread the word to others. I'm doing what God told me to do to help everyone. Like Jesus told me, THE ANTICHRIST WILL BE HERE SOON, THERE ISN'T MUCH TIME LEFT, SAVE AS MANY SOULS AS YOU CAN BY SPREADING THE WORD.
This best efficent way i can do this is through the internet. Please repost it, pass it along, email it, do whatever it takes to spread the word.
THIS IS AN ACTUAL EVEN THAT HAPPENED TO ME LAST NIGHT THAT'S RIGHT ME,
RACHEL KESSLER
Pass it along, please, if you have any questions search for me on myspace or just send me a message and i will gladly answer any questions.
Best of luck,
Rachel Kessler
ps. Name calling..hmm this is a forum not a court room. 14 vs. a 20 year old who has no faith in God and doesnt believe he cares. Hmm i seem to be the smartest of the two.
And i wont be name calling when im a lawyer, but i can sure do it now.
You could be satan for all we know. You are putting down God.
You are doubting the fact that Jesus wasnt enough for our sins.
You dont believe that Jesus comes to people, he came to me, and it wasnt satan. I pray for you that he will help you.
And you are referrring me to an idiotic movie. My dream isnt just a movie. I never believed before, and everything that was in my dream was in the bible. I didnt even know.
If your against God so much then get out of this Den please. Ive argued many points in all my time i have been here, and quite a number of people have told me i am an excellent debater.
Your poll isnt even worded correctly. You worded it with such exaggeration of how he will freak out over crosses, that the poll choice isnt fair.
He isnt afraid of a cross.
your choices consist of your attitude towards it. "He will freak out because the symbols of his death are all over the place"
"He will be totally ok with seeing signs of his death all over the place"
Your wording is not fair.
its like saying that he will be ok with the crosses is the worst choice.
an example is saying
"George Bush is a dumb president and he cant cook well"
" John Kerry makes excellent ketchup and can cook amazingly"
Wich is the more positive choice? Obviously the one your for. You made your choice more positive.
The poll needs to be nuetral (sp?)
so people can deicide on their own without your input.
and the fact is, everyone is against you. Your the only one who voted your choice.
Well thats all for now. I will try to ignore your useless posts....
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To Die_Hard_Punk:
http://www.dreemmoods.com/cgi-bin/dreamforum/YaBB.pl?num=1153670028 (http://www.dreemmoods.com/cgi-bin/dreamforum/YaBB.pl?num=1153670028)
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thanks for the link. I joined. :)
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@ the shots you took at rachel...
He gives free choice as to whether you accept or reject Him...accepting is the only way to wipe the sins clean and become holy in His sight. if someone chooses rejection, then they made that choice of their own accord...they earned themself eternal separation from God. God doesnt send anyone. and with all do respect, dont call my God "petty".
yea, Jesus knew He would die, but He didnt go straight to heaven when He died...He died baring the sins of the world. it's believed by some that He went to Abraham's Bosom (AKA purgatory) to have those who followed God before Jesus came, sent to heaven. after he resurrected, he later ascended to heaven.
and yea there's always been wars in the Middle East and other places...the Bible says that there will be many wars when the time draws near. there have been more consecutive wars in the past 100 years than any other time in recorded history.
and while the mark of the beast may not necessarily be a chip...a mark will be used in corolation with the beast's number, 666.
earthquakes being another sign. they have increased in intensity and frequency some 2000% since Israel returned to the land in 1948.
God is not powerless against the anti-christ...his 7-year reign is just part of the end-times. he will fall at the battle of armageddon.
you don't gotta believe anything you dont wanna...thats the beauty of free-will...but dont insult my faith.
@ your question to me...
christians decided the cross...and there are other symbols but cross is the most-used. its a symbol that was chosen...i have no doubt that Jesus doesnt have a problem with it.
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Thank you, ive been waitin for you Loco.lol
And yes, our god is not "petty". He is kind, he is generose(sp?not awake), he gives us many chances in life. He is loving, he is caring, but he is aslo strict. He is the all around perfect God.Not much to argue over, and I gotta hit the sack, gotta get used to a new sleeping schedual for school.
G'night
thanks Loco :)
(p.s.) Only spelling Mistake was the generose, and thats because I forgot..lol
But its back in Paragraph form. Once again Sorry Iz, I kinda got worked up.
Oh yes, All seeing Eye,
If your so much against God about the things you've said e.x."Jesus died on the cross with all the sins of humanity, thats not enough for all of humanity" You said something close to that.
also "God knew this was going to happen, so did he allow the people who killed his son to go to heaven too"
Your being a smart alec. If you do not believe in God, If you dont believe the true things you are supposed to believe, then please leave this particular debate.
Smart remarks like that shows you don't belive in God, then you should leave the debate.You are dissing our God major. He is not "petty". You are saying what hes done with his son isnt really a big deal, because he was going to heaven anyways.
Its amazing how you believe that there is a God, but your agaisnt everything he's ever done for humainty.
Take a look of my dream on the second page. Maybe your the one who needs God, not us. We know who our God is, and he isn't what your claiming to be. Your so against him and changing our minds that everything he's done isn't really anything if you think about it, well YES IT IS! You are sounding much like the anti christ, trying to trick us into believing lies about our God. Your acting like your possessed by a demon or something. I've noticed your very bitter.
I dont mean to offend you im just saying what your acting like.
The questions for you I have is, " Do you believe in God?"
"And why are you so against him" as in putting him down and saying his work ment nothing.
sorry for any name calling or anything, i didnt mean it. Here we go again for another long ashh Msp comment, brace yourself Loco.. :P
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I am adopting. YOu shouldnt get married, id feel bad for your future husband, i mean wife..
Your an idiot, your right.
YEs i believe in him. He is coming again, I suppose if you dont believe it you wont be saved. Have fun on EArth with the anti christ. :)
Whoa there. Gay jokes. I didn't realize you were so mature.
Consider this a court; stop with the name calling or get suspended.
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He gives free choice as to whether you accept or reject Him...accepting is the only way to wipe the sins clean and become holy in His sight. if someone chooses rejection, then they made that choice of their own accord...they earned themself eternal separation from God.
What about those who have never heard of Jesus?
God doesnt send anyone.
Huh?
and with all do respect, dont call my God "petty".
Smite me now O mighty smiter!
yea, Jesus knew He would die, but He didnt go straight to heaven when He died...He died baring the sins of the world. it's believed by some that He went to Abraham's Bosom (AKA purgatory) to have those who followed God before Jesus came, sent to heaven. after he resurrected, he later ascended to heaven.
Let me pose a question. Did the romans who strung up jesus on the cross go to heaven for doing God's work?
and yea there's always been wars in the Middle East and other places...the Bible says that there will be many wars when the time draws near. there have been more consecutive wars in the past 100 years than any other time in recorded history.
No, the 19th century had more wars and conflicts of note than the 20th. If anything, war is on the decline.
and while the mark of the beast may not necessarily be a chip...a mark will be used in corolation with the beast's number, 666.
Naturaly, however the assertion that everything related to technology or the government tracking people or items == the mark of the beast is straight paranoia. When barcode was first invented many saw it as the mark of the beast.
earthquakes being another sign. they have increased in intensity and frequency some 2000% since Israel returned to the land in 1948.
Care to show some data on that? Im looking at the USGS earthquake website, and a few things stand out. First, the intensity of quakes over the last 200 years has remained very consistant. Second, it seems amazingly obvious that as people become more widespread, technology improves, and data collection more accurate, we would be able to track more earthquakes now than we could 200 years ago. based on the history of recorded quakes in california alone in the last hundred years, it is safe to assume that there were just as many, if not more quakes, in the past. Geologicaly, the earth has become more stable as it has cooled, and will continue to become more stable.
God is not powerless against the anti-christ...his 7-year reign is just part of the end-times. he will fall at the battle of armageddon.
Why a battle? why wouldnt god just snap his almighty fingers and make the anti christ stop existing?
you don't gotta believe anything you dont wanna...thats the beauty of free-will...but dont insult my faith.
Im not trying to insult it, these are the concerns and questions i have. If you cant handle an honest deconstruction of your faith, its time to find something else to do.
@Punk: Im not even going to try and read that, its full of errors, horrible grammar, misspellings, and way to much white space. Get a dictionary and look up Paragraph.
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Sorry, Iz, just really worked up.
I spaced it for you, Thoguht you wouldn't be able to read in paragraph form as well. I'm dislexic, so I like things spaced, but thats just me. Try reading it. I think you already have but you have nothing to say to it. But If youd like Id go back an edit it.
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I am adopting. YOu shouldnt get married, id feel bad for your future husband, i mean wife..
Your an idiot, your right.
YEs i believe in him. He is coming again, I suppose if you dont believe it you wont be saved. Have fun on EArth with the anti christ. :)
Whoa there. Gay jokes. I didn't realize you were so mature.
Consider this a court; stop with the name calling or get suspended.
sorry for the double post, but Iz, I had a typo, and my mom was yellin at me to get off the computer. I didnt mean for it to be that way, but now that i look at it i kinda laugh, cause i didnt mean to do that.
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if your dyslexic, try running your posts through word's spelling and grammar checker, I know I would if I knew I was making mistakes.
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Most people dont have a problem with me spacing it. And if the majority don't, then neither do I. I am replying like you did while you did quotes. I am not going back and quoting you, I am just replying in.
You, however, aren't writing in paragraph form either. So don't say anything , you're being a hypocrit.
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O.o
A series of sentences which are about one aspect of a topic.
universitywriting.shu.ac.uk/defs.htm
If any of my quote snippet responses are long enough, they become paragraph. I prefer to be succinct in my writing.
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Cool. Ok? That is you, not me. I may type in any form i want, It is a free country. In my country anyways....
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What about those who have never heard of Jesus?
its believed that those who honestly never heard or got the chance to learn about Christ will be viewed innocent, as a newborn baby would be.
Huh?
God doesnt send anyone to hell.
Let me pose a question. Did the romans who strung up jesus on the cross go to heaven for doing God's work?
the Romans were forgiven just as the rest of the world was...if they accepted Christ, then yea they'd be saved.
No, the 19th century had more wars and conflicts of note than the 20th. If anything, war is on the decline.
http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/war-1900.htm
Care to show some data on that? Im looking at the USGS earthquake website, and a few things stand out. First, the intensity of quakes over the last 200 years has remained very consistant. Second, it seems amazingly obvious that as people become more widespread, technology improves, and data collection more accurate, we would be able to track more earthquakes now than we could 200 years ago. based on the history of recorded quakes in california alone in the last hundred years, it is safe to assume that there were just as many, if not more quakes, in the past. Geologicaly, the earth has become more stable as it has cooled, and will continue to become more stable.
the universal almanac says that there were only 21 earthquakes of major strength between the years 1000 and 1800. but between 1800 and 1900 there were 18 major earthquakes. between 1900 and 1950, there were 33 major quakes-almost as many as the number in the preceding 1,850 years. between 1950 and 1991 there were 93 major earthquakes-- almost triple the number of the previous half century-which claimed the lives of 1.3 million people around the world. between 1992-2001 there were 171 major earthquakes-- That's 6 TIMES the amount between 1900--1950. national earthquake center reports: on an annual average based since 1900. YEARLY: There are 17 major, 134 strong, 1,319 moderate, 13,200 light & 130,000 minor earthquakes. On a magnitude of 2-3, there are 1,000 per day. On a magnitude of 1-2, there are 8,000 per day.
year 2000 estimated deaths from earthquakes = 234 people
year 2004 estimated deaths from earthquakes = OVER 284,000 people
Why a battle? why wouldnt god just snap his almighty fingers and make the anti christ stop existing?
because the battle of armageddon is how He purges the earth of evil after the tribulation. in the end times, those on earth have the choice of standing behind God or standing behind the anti-christ. giving people the free will to align themselves with who they choose.
Im not trying to insult it, these are the concerns and questions i have. If you cant handle an honest deconstruction of your faith, its time to find something else to do.
lol, you're not deconstructing anything.
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Very nice Loco, couldn't have said it better. Its amazing how right he thinks he is..
The all seeing Eye, I found this:http://www.lamblion.com/Web15-00.php copy and paste that into your internet bar.
The signs in nature. Look for it. Sure they have been here all the time, but they increase and become more dramatic like I said. I automaticly knew it before i even read it anywhere. I told you I knew what I was talking about.
The link should help anyone with Jesus and the signs that hes coming back with. Its very intresting.
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its believed that those who honestly never heard or got the chance to learn about Christ will be viewed innocent, as a newborn baby would be.
Mkay, that answers that, thanks.
God doesnt send anyone to hell.
How do they get there?
the Romans were forgiven just as the rest of the world was...if they accepted Christ, then yea they'd be saved.
Good, ill be sure to accept christ on my deathbed, just in case.
http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/war-1900.htm
Whats with you and obscure 5+ year old sources?
anyways, from your own source:
Before we get carried away condemning the century as a whole, we should keep in mind that the enormous body count has come about largely because there are so many more people available to kill. For example, the St. Bartholemew's Day Massacre in France in 1575 killed some 50,000 people, which, by 20th Century standards, is hardly enough to rate a place on these maps; however, considering that there were only 15 million Frenchmen at the time, this massacre would be the equivalent of 800,000 modern Americans -- a very frightening number indeed.
No I havent read the whole thing yet, but thats because it only deals with the 20th century. The last one hundred years is a mere fraction of the last 10,000. To clarify, 1900 to 1999 = 20th century, 1800 to 1899 = 19th century.
the universal almanac says that there were only 21 earthquakes of major strength between the years 1000 and 1800. but between 1800 and 1900 there were 18 major earthquakes. between 1900 and 1950, there were 33 major quakes-almost as many as the number in the preceding 1,850 years. between 1950 and 1991 there were 93 major earthquakes-- almost triple the number of the previous half century-which claimed the lives of 1.3 million people around the world. between 1992-2001 there were 171 major earthquakes-- That's 6 TIMES the amount between 1900--1950. national earthquake center reports: on an annual average based since 1900. YEARLY: There are 17 major, 134 strong, 1,319 moderate, 13,200 light & 130,000 minor earthquakes. On a magnitude of 2-3, there are 1,000 per day. On a magnitude of 1-2, there are 8,000 per day.
year 2000 estimated deaths from earthquakes = 234 people
year 2004 estimated deaths from earthquakes = OVER 284,000 people
Again with the unkown and old sources. anyways, 2000 and 2004 are 2 years, last i checked there was some time between them, although I suppose you aren't one to let an inconvenient truth stand in the way, huh? If you had bothered to be honest, you would have mentioned that in 2005 only about 90,000 people died, and this year only about 6,000 have died. That is a decline. Anyways, I had some time, so I did my research and came up with two graphs. The first one outlines the number of deaths by year of the last 26 years due to quakes. What should stand out is the big spike in 2004. Except, that number included deaths that resulted from the tsunami that occured after the quake. Aside from that, quake activity has been fairly consistant. Fact is, quakes are not something that we can realy predict. Sure there are theories about when the next big one is going to hit, based on historical data, but that doesnt change the fact that in any given year any number of people could die.
The second chart outlines all known major quakes with a death toll greater than 50,000. Of special note is that the biggest quake in the last 1200 years was 800 years ago, and that 1200 years ago the death toll for quakes was similar to what we have in the last decade. in between you see a fairly consistant ebb and flow, like a sine wave. Dont forget what I said early, and what the USGS also says. There are more people on the earth, and there are more monitoring stations than ever before. 800 years ago there were maybe 300 to 400 million people on the earth. The quake that occured then took out about 830,000 people. If a similar quake happened today, we would see a death toll of around 12 million people. As I said before, earthquakes arent becoming more often and more intense, there are just more people around to notice them and be killed by them.
(http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/6905/quakes1980presented8.gif)
(http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/514/worstquakessi3.gif)
From the USGS Earthquake Website
Are Earthquakes Really on the Increase?
We continue to be asked by many people throughout the world if earthquakes are on the increase. Although it may seem that we are having more earthquakes, earthquakes of magnitude 7.0 or greater have remained fairly constant.
A partial explanation may lie in the fact that in the last twenty years, we have definitely had an increase in the number of earthquakes we have been able to locate each year. This is because of the tremendous increase in the number of seismograph stations in the world and the many improvements in global communications. In 1931, there were about 350 stations operating in the world; today, there are more that 8,000 stations and the data now comes in rapidly from these stations by electronic mail, internet and satellite. This increase in the number of stations and the more timely receipt of data has allowed us and other seismological centers to locate earthquakes more rapidly and to locate many small earthquakes which were undetected in earlier years. The NEIC now locates about 20,000 earthquakes each year or approximately 50 per day. Also, because of the improvements in communications and the increased interest in the environment and natural disasters, the public now learns about more earthquakes.
According to long-term records (since about 1900), we expect about 17 major earthquakes (7.0 - 7.9) and one great earthquake (8.0 or above) in any given year.
because the battle of armageddon is how He purges the earth of evil after the tribulation. in the end times, those on earth have the choice of standing behind God or standing behind the anti-christ. giving people the free will to align themselves with who they choose.
Mkay, so long as its very obvious who the anti christ is so that people have a fair chance to oppose him/her, thats totaly cool. However it still seems odd that god needs worshipers, its not like this is Black & White or Stargate.
lol, you're not deconstructing anything.
I'll look for a more accurate word, since true deconstruction of the bible would be a very lengthy and involved process.
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God doesnt send people to hell. They send themselves to hell. And you cannot just live a life of sin then all the sudden you ask for him on your deathbed. It does not work that way. You could die tomorrow instantly and wouldn't have the chance to ask, and you will be asked by God why you should be able to come to heaven. "Because you simple were "a good person" doesn't mean you will go to heaven. You must have a relationship with Him, you must accept him as your Lord and savior. You can't just ask for Him on your deathbed, because he will even tell you when you get judged that you never lived a life of a follower or did what a true follower did until your dieing day so you could go to heaven. You did it for the pure benidet of you, which is greed. Which is one of the 7 deadliest sins. By the way,It does NOT work that way. God will know what you have done. You want to live the life YOU want to live, not what God wants for you. Therefore you will not go to heaven if you ask for The Lord on your dieing day. Therefore you have done what you have pleased and done what you wanted, and then figure you can get off the hook because you ask for him once. He will not let you come to heaven if that is the case.
Ask and preacher, pastor, or preist, and they will tell you what I have told you. I know what God wants from us. I know what he wants for me. But you will have to figure out what he wants from you in life. Obviously the basics to get to heaven, Believe he died on the cross for all the sins of humainity, believe he is the only God. Read the passage(bible), and have a personal relationship by talking and praying to him.
A quote I read, not exact but pretty close to it.
A man died and he was a good man. He went to church, made money for his family, had a good job, made alot of money, a nice car, and a wonderful house.
When he approached God, God asked him "Why do you think you should go to heaven? What acheivements have you reached in life to recieve such an honor?" I will rack up the things by points. Once you reach 100 points, you may enter the kingdom of Heaven"
The man replied, "well, I was a lawyer"
God: one point.
man: One point?! I made lots of money,won many cases! It should be at least 5 points!
God: Ok, 5 points. Next?
Man: well I didnt beat my wife or children.
God: one point.
Man: Only one point? Alot of men do that!
God: dont argue with me, what else.
Man: I had a nice car, a nice house, and fed my family!
God:3 points.
Man:I never cheated on my wife!
God: 2 points.
God"thats one point
man:thats only 12 points total! How am i suppsed to get 100?
God: Think about this. How many things have you done for yourself in life?
Man: well alot I suppose. At least over a hundred, I just cant remember right now
God: Then it must havent have been that important or meaningful.
Man: well....
God: Now think about this.
Man: yes?
God: How many things in life have you done for other people? Simple nice things?
Man:... (the man said nothing and looked down)
God: Have you not helped any elder by holding a door? By dropping by friends and family jus out of the kindness of your heart? Not just because you had to? Have you given food or money to any homless person? Even a small amount of change is still a thing worth alot to me.
Say every time you held a door for someone, that, to me, is worth 10 points. That was not for yourself, but for someone else. Every time you donate to an orphanage or a church, it would count as 20 points. Its kind small things in life that are wprth the most. You never had a relationship with me. Sure you went to church, had a great job, but you really did not sucseed in life. Material things will not come with you to heaven, such as money, houses, and cars.
Man: I suppose you are right.
that is a quote i had read somewhere. I didnt finish the rest of it, but what happens is that the man does not go to Heaven. He was never serious about Father God. He only thought of himself.
That is an awesome quote. One of my favorites. I hope you enjoyed reading it. :)
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God is all knowing, why should we have to rely on our feeble memories when he has seen our entire lives? If god didnt want me to have free will, I would not have been granted it. The best thing I can do is make the most of this gift. All this stuff about God testing humanity, its like putting a rat in a maze. God is to Me as I am to an Amoeba. For a being as mighty as god to be so very concerned with human affairs seems to me, very absurd.
Not to mention in the last few days you have done satans work here, turning me away from christ, insulting me, calling me names. Very unchristian indeed.
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I can get pretty p1ssed, and some of the things you got me pretty fired up about, and i am NOT the perfect christian, or do i act like it. That I know. I just donelike you insulting my God. I am very sorry about the insults. All is forgiven? :huh: I forgive you :blink:
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Im not insulting your god, Im questioning the things you say about Him/Her. I can't ask your god directly, and as busy as I am, this is the next best thing. If your god was *realy* that bothered, i wouldnt be here right now, id be a smote of ash on the ground, smoldering. And if your right then ill spend forever in hell, so dont worry about it, Im sure God can handle him/herself just fine.
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Ok...well Do you forgive me? I forgive you for the name calling and a insults, I hope you forgive me as well
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Here's the thing, whatever you say, doesnt bother me in the slightest, so there is nothing to forgive :D
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I think it will be fine but I do respect anybody elses veiw.
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Hmm I suppose. I do respect it, but I am totally agaisnt it.. But that is just how I work. Like the Lord says,
(a favorite quote of mine)
"Go from village to village, proclaim it, and if they do not listen, clap the dirt from your sandals and move on "
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Whats with you and obscure 5+ year old sources?
anyways, from your own source:
Before we get carried away condemning the century as a whole, we should keep in mind that the enormous body count has come about largely because there are so many more people available to kill. For example, the St. Bartholemew's Day Massacre in France in 1575 killed some 50,000 people, which, by 20th Century standards, is hardly enough to rate a place on these maps; however, considering that there were only 15 million Frenchmen at the time, this massacre would be the equivalent of 800,000 modern Americans -- a very frightening number indeed.
No I havent read the whole thing yet, but thats because it only deals with the 20th century. The last one hundred years is a mere fraction of the last 10,000. To clarify, 1900 to 1999 = 20th century, 1800 to 1899 = 19th century.
you're gonna proportionate human life? wow. that still doesnt change the fact that there have been more conflicts and more death from those conflicts than in the 19th century.
Again with the unkown and old sources. anyways, 2000 and 2004 are 2 years, last i checked there was some time between them, although I suppose you aren't one to let an inconvenient truth stand in the way, huh? If you had bothered to be honest, you would have mentioned that in 2005 only about 90,000 people died, and this year only about 6,000 have died. That is a decline. Anyways, I had some time, so I did my research and came up with two graphs. The first one outlines the number of deaths by year of the last 26 years due to quakes. What should stand out is the big spike in 2004. Except, that number included deaths that resulted from the tsunami that occured after the quake. Aside from that, quake activity has been fairly consistant. Fact is, quakes are not something that we can realy predict. Sure there are theories about when the next big one is going to hit, based on historical data, but that doesnt change the fact that in any given year any number of people could die.
The second chart outlines all known major quakes with a death toll greater than 50,000. Of special note is that the biggest quake in the last 1200 years was 800 years ago, and that 1200 years ago the death toll for quakes was similar to what we have in the last decade. in between you see a fairly consistant ebb and flow, like a sine wave. Dont forget what I said early, and what the USGS also says. There are more people on the earth, and there are more monitoring stations than ever before. 800 years ago there were maybe 300 to 400 million people on the earth. The quake that occured then took out about 830,000 people. If a similar quake happened today, we would see a death toll of around 12 million people. As I said before, earthquakes arent becoming more often and more intense, there are just more people around to notice them and be killed by them.
try taking a look at your own graph...yea, it spikes high in 2004 like i said....but everything's normal besides that huh? you brushed 2005 off like 90,000+ deaths was nothing...the 2005 death toll easily doubles, if not triples the recorded tolls of the past 26 years of the graph alone. it also greatly exceeds the toll of your quake on the second chart. oh and 2006...? the year aint over yet.
Mkay, so long as its very obvious who the anti christ is so that people have a fair chance to oppose him/her, thats totaly cool. However it still seems odd that god needs worshipers, its not like this is Black & White or Stargate.
God doesnt need anybody...He wants people to spend eternity with Him and not suffer eternal separation from Him, which is why He gave us the means to.
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Whats with you and obscure 5+ year old sources?
anyways, from your own source:
Before we get carried away condemning the century as a whole, we should keep in mind that the enormous body count has come about largely because there are so many more people available to kill. For example, the St. Bartholemew's Day Massacre in France in 1575 killed some 50,000 people, which, by 20th Century standards, is hardly enough to rate a place on these maps; however, considering that there were only 15 million Frenchmen at the time, this massacre would be the equivalent of 800,000 modern Americans -- a very frightening number indeed.
No I havent read the whole thing yet, but thats because it only deals with the 20th century. The last one hundred years is a mere fraction of the last 10,000. To clarify, 1900 to 1999 = 20th century, 1800 to 1899 = 19th century.
you're gonna proportionate human life? wow. that still doesnt change the fact that there have been more conflicts and more death from those conflicts than in the 19th century.
Again with the unkown and old sources. anyways, 2000 and 2004 are 2 years, last i checked there was some time between them, although I suppose you aren't one to let an inconvenient truth stand in the way, huh? If you had bothered to be honest, you would have mentioned that in 2005 only about 90,000 people died, and this year only about 6,000 have died. That is a decline. Anyways, I had some time, so I did my research and came up with two graphs. The first one outlines the number of deaths by year of the last 26 years due to quakes. What should stand out is the big spike in 2004. Except, that number included deaths that resulted from the tsunami that occured after the quake. Aside from that, quake activity has been fairly consistant. Fact is, quakes are not something that we can realy predict. Sure there are theories about when the next big one is going to hit, based on historical data, but that doesnt change the fact that in any given year any number of people could die.
The second chart outlines all known major quakes with a death toll greater than 50,000. Of special note is that the biggest quake in the last 1200 years was 800 years ago, and that 1200 years ago the death toll for quakes was similar to what we have in the last decade. in between you see a fairly consistant ebb and flow, like a sine wave. Dont forget what I said early, and what the USGS also says. There are more people on the earth, and there are more monitoring stations than ever before. 800 years ago there were maybe 300 to 400 million people on the earth. The quake that occured then took out about 830,000 people. If a similar quake happened today, we would see a death toll of around 12 million people. As I said before, earthquakes arent becoming more often and more intense, there are just more people around to notice them and be killed by them.
try taking a look at your own graph...yea, it spikes high in 2004 like i said....but everything's normal besides that huh? you brushed 2005 off like 90,000+ deaths was nothing...the 2005 death toll easily doubles, if not triples the recorded tolls of the past 26 years of the graph alone. it also greatly exceeds the toll of your quake on the second chart. oh and 2006...? the year aint over yet.
Mkay, so long as its very obvious who the anti christ is so that people have a fair chance to oppose him/her, thats totaly cool. However it still seems odd that god needs worshipers, its not like this is Black & White or Stargate.
God doesnt need anybody...He wants people to spend eternity with Him and not suffer eternal separation from Him, which is why He gave us the means to.
^^Exactly. Learn a little more about our God before you go around making falso accusations about him. And 2006 isnt over yet. Your graphs are whats incorrect. Find accurate information before you post next time.
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try taking a look at your own graph...yea, it spikes high in 2004 like i said....but everything's normal besides that huh?
Lets start with this, In 1976 there was a quake comparable in death toll to the one in 2004, and comparable to the one 1200 years ago. Again, there are More People Alive Now than There Were 30 Years Ago, or 100 Years ago, or 1000 Years ago.
you brushed 2005 off like 90,000+ deaths was nothing...the 2005 death toll easily doubles, if not triples the recorded tolls of the past 26 years of the graph alone.
no it doesnt, the numbers clearly show that 2005 was less than half the number of deaths from 1980 to 2003. it also greatly exceeds the toll of your quake on the second chart.
Thats almost a million people, and thats when there were maybe 300 million people in the world. Please be aware that the two graphs have different scales. oh and 2006...? the year aint over yet.
Its half over, and stop wishing death on people.
Mkay, so long as its very obvious who the anti christ is so that people have a fair chance to oppose him/her, thats totaly cool. However it still seems odd that god needs worshipers, its not like this is Black & White or Stargate.
God doesnt need anybody...He wants people to spend eternity with Him and not suffer eternal separation from Him, which is why He gave us the means to.
[/quote]Im doing quite dandy and im seperated from God. What are the long term effects of seperation from God? Do such things matter to an immortal being like those who have died? Seperation from God isnt that bad, its the whole "In Hell" part that makes God cruel.
^^Exactly. Learn a little more about our God before you go around making falso accusations about him. And 2006 isnt over yet. Your graphs are whats incorrect. Find accurate information before you post next time.
1) If you disagree with the graph, you disagree with facts.
2) http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqcenter/top10.php
3) Stop being a sycophant, if you dont have anything original to contribute, then stay out the thread.
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We aren't wishing death on people. Simply stated is that the year isn't over yet and there very likley could be more earthqukes. Dont make false accusations.
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We aren't wishing death on people. Simply stated is that the year isn't over yet and there very likley could be more earthqukes. Dont make false accusations.
Would you want more quakes to happen? is being right so important people must die?
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We aren't wishing death on people. Simply stated is that the year isn't over yet and there very likley could be more earthqukes. Dont make false accusations.
Would you want more quakes to happen? is being right so important people must die?
I hope you realize you are making yourself look like more of an idiot...
It was a statement they were making, but since you're one for twisting words, you've taken it the wrong way and now you're just pushing it more to try and make them look bad.
Just move along and drop it. They were just stating that the year has yet to end and there is plenty of time left in the year for something bad to happen. This doesn't mean they hope it does. It's simply a statement.
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We aren't wishing death on people. Simply stated is that the year isn't over yet and there very likley could be more earthqukes. Dont make false accusations.
Would you want more quakes to happen? is being right so important people must die?
I hope you realize you are making yourself look like more of an idiot...
It was a statement they were making, but since you're one for twisting words, you've taken it the wrong way and now you're just pushing it more to try and make them look bad.
Just move along and drop it. They were just stating that the year has yet to end and there is plenty of time left in the year for something bad to happen. This doesn't mean they hope it does. It's simply a statement.
Its more than that, because if more death's dont happen, it means earthquakes are random, not divine like they claim. by their reasoning there should have been over 250K dead last year, and more than that this year.
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We aren't wishing death on people. Simply stated is that the year isn't over yet and there very likley could be more earthqukes. Dont make false accusations.
Would you want more quakes to happen? is being right so important people must die?
I hope you realize you are making yourself look like more of an idiot...
It was a statement they were making, but since you're one for twisting words, you've taken it the wrong way and now you're just pushing it more to try and make them look bad.
Just move along and drop it. They were just stating that the year has yet to end and there is plenty of time left in the year for something bad to happen. This doesn't mean they hope it does. It's simply a statement.
Thanks Roger! Finally a smart person has come into the debate. :)
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We aren't wishing death on people. Simply stated is that the year isn't over yet and there very likley could be more earthqukes. Dont make false accusations.
Would you want more quakes to happen? is being right so important people must die?
I hope you realize you are making yourself look like more of an idiot...
It was a statement they were making, but since you're one for twisting words, you've taken it the wrong way and now you're just pushing it more to try and make them look bad.
Just move along and drop it. They were just stating that the year has yet to end and there is plenty of time left in the year for something bad to happen. This doesn't mean they hope it does. It's simply a statement.
Its more than that, because if more death's dont happen, it means earthquakes are random, not divine like they claim. by their reasoning there should have been over 250K dead last year, and more than that this year.
Their reasoning states nothing like that.
Being a Christian, I believe that God has an influence over everything. But what you're saying is that we should be able to predict what God has in store. This is the problem...we can't. We don't know if there's going to be an earthquake today that's going to kill thousands...it could just happen. But since you're not religious, and you don't follow a faith, you'll just put this down.
Here comes the problem with all your debates. All of them are about religion. There's always going to be something to debate and you know your non-religious views will always counteract the views by a religion.
I suggest you just drop this entire topic and move on...
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This is one theory why God couldn't exist....
One: Assuming God is all powerful (obviously he is, he is God, if he wasn't all powerful, he wouldn't be a God)
Two: Assuming God is all good.
So, assuming these are true...which all Christian's do believe are true.
For there to be evil on earth, God must either one, not have the power to get rid of the evil, which would mean that he is not all powerful, meaning he is not a God.
Or
He is not all good, and accepts the evil on earth, which would go against everything in the Bible, because according to the Bible, God is all good.
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1. It is syblysom, jesus want's us to to remember his sacrifice.
2. quit being mindlessly predjiduce, it is obvious you hate christians with no reason.
This is one theory why God couldn't exist....
One: Assuming God is all powerful (obviously he is, he is God, if he wasn't all powerful, he wouldn't be a God)
Two: Assuming God is all good.
So, assuming these are true...which all Christian's do believe are true.
For there to be evil on earth, God must either one, not have the power to get rid of the evil, which would mean that he is not all powerful, meaning he is not a God.
Or
He is not all good, and accepts the evil on earth, which would go against everything in the Bible, because according to the Bible, God is all good.
He wants to have a choice to follow him or not. Imagine you created a computer and you programmed it to say yes to everything, now imagine if you asked question. get it?
please read the bible before you slam it.
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I have read the Bible.
And Im not saying that he didn't make everything good, Im saying.
Either he doesn't have the power to get rid of the evil, or he accepts the evil in the world, which one is it?
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He has the power to get rid of the evil. But it's a test of faith. In the hard times, will we keep our faith or will we lose it? Those who want to go to Heaven will keep the faith. Those who are against Him will suffer.
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Why test our faith if he knows our faith, he knows who believes and who does not believe, no need to test.
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Because people change. He wants to know if you really would stand up for him, or its all just an act. He wants to have his followers help the unsaved become saved, so they can live in his kingdom too.
You do not like Christians, but it doesn't mean you have to twist things around which in the end is making God look bad.
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He knows when people change and believe, he knows who really believes, he knows who will go to hell and who will live, the people who live will be in The Book of Life and the rest go to hell, so what is the point of the anti-christ and all this other sick evil jokes hes playing on us.
Its alredy been 'written', so what is the need to test us.
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It doesn't matter. He wants it they way it is so he can see what you have done in your life, and what you will do for yourself and others, and how you live your life.
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*Note to Squiddy and The all seeing Eye:
Shut up. If you aren't Christian, leave it alone. It looks to me like you're just finding a pitiful excuse to slam Christians. I, being a Christian, think Jesus doesn't give a hoot about seeing the symbol of his death. If I were him (which I'm obviously not), I wouldn't mind seeing crosses. In fact, I'd probably be happy that people remembered what I did for them. Just let Rachel believe what she wants to believe, and drop it. You've both given me bad headaches.
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*Note to Squiddy and The all seeing Eye:
Shut up. If you aren't Christian, leave it alone. It looks to me like you're just finding a pitiful excuse to slam Christians. I, being a Christian, think Jesus doesn't give a hoot about seeing the symbol of his death. If I were him (which I'm obviously not), I wouldn't mind seeing crosses. In fact, I'd probably be happy that people remembered what I did for them. Just let Rachel believe what she wants to believe, and drop it. You've both given me bad headaches.
QFT.
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*Note to Squiddy and The all seeing Eye:
Shut up. If you aren't Christian, leave it alone. It looks to me like you're just finding a pitiful excuse to slam Christians. I, being a Christian, think Jesus doesn't give a hoot about seeing the symbol of his death. If I were him (which I'm obviously not), I wouldn't mind seeing crosses. In fact, I'd probably be happy that people remembered what I did for them. Just let Rachel believe what she wants to believe, and drop it. You've both given me bad headaches.
*APPLAUSE*
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It doesn't matter. He wants it they way it is so he can see what you have done in your life, and what you will do for yourself and others, and how you live your life.
He doesn't have to wait to see what happens, he knows what will happen, he doesn't have to see who believes he knows. Iv said that a million times already and I don't see why you don't see that part. What you are saying implies that he doesn't know.
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It doesn't matter. He wants it they way it is so he can see what you have done in your life, and what you will do for yourself and others, and how you live your life.
He doesn't have to wait to see what happens, he knows what will happen, he doesn't have to see who believes he knows. Iv said that a million times already and I don't see why you don't see that part. What you are saying implies that he doesn't know.
Alright already, geez. Will you get off of Rachel's back already? It's getting (or should I say gotten) really old.
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*Note to Squiddy and The all seeing Eye:
Shut up. If you aren't Christian, leave it alone. It looks to me like you're just finding a pitiful excuse to slam Christians. I, being a Christian, think Jesus doesn't give a hoot about seeing the symbol of his death. If I were him (which I'm obviously not), I wouldn't mind seeing crosses. In fact, I'd probably be happy that people remembered what I did for them. Just let Rachel believe what she wants to believe, and drop it. You've both given me bad headaches.
You choose to enter this thread, deal with it.
If ratcher is going to be a twit and repeat the same thing over and over without addressing squiddy's point then she has no argument.
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*Note to Squiddy and The all seeing Eye:
Shut up. If you aren't Christian, leave it alone. It looks to me like you're just finding a pitiful excuse to slam Christians. I, being a Christian, think Jesus doesn't give a hoot about seeing the symbol of his death. If I were him (which I'm obviously not), I wouldn't mind seeing crosses. In fact, I'd probably be happy that people remembered what I did for them. Just let Rachel believe what she wants to believe, and drop it. You've both given me bad headaches.
You choose to enter this thread, deal with it.
If ratcher is going to be a twit and repeat the same thing over and over without addressing squiddy's point then she has no argument.
Will you shut your trap already? Maybe Rachel does have no argument, but that's no reason to call her a twit. And her name's Rachel, not Ratcher.
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*Note to Squiddy and The all seeing Eye:
Shut up. If you aren't Christian, leave it alone. It looks to me like you're just finding a pitiful excuse to slam Christians. I, being a Christian, think Jesus doesn't give a hoot about seeing the symbol of his death. If I were him (which I'm obviously not), I wouldn't mind seeing crosses. In fact, I'd probably be happy that people remembered what I did for them. Just let Rachel believe what she wants to believe, and drop it. You've both given me bad headaches.
You choose to enter this thread, deal with it.
If ratcher is going to be a twit and repeat the same thing over and over without addressing squiddy's point then she has no argument.
Will you shut your trap already? Maybe Rachel does have no argument, but that's no reason to call her a twit. And her name's Rachel, not Ratcher.
Troll. You are not a good christian, turning people away from Jesus like that. Not good at all...
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Can we just get back on topic, if you are going to argue on something other then the debate do it somewhere else.
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*Note to Squiddy and The all seeing Eye:
Shut up. If you aren't Christian, leave it alone. It looks to me like you're just finding a pitiful excuse to slam Christians. I, being a Christian, think Jesus doesn't give a hoot about seeing the symbol of his death. If I were him (which I'm obviously not), I wouldn't mind seeing crosses. In fact, I'd probably be happy that people remembered what I did for them. Just let Rachel believe what she wants to believe, and drop it. You've both given me bad headaches.
You choose to enter this thread, deal with it.
If ratcher is going to be a twit and repeat the same thing over and over without addressing squiddy's point then she has no argument.
Will you shut your trap already? Maybe Rachel does have no argument, but that's no reason to call her a twit. And her name's Rachel, not Ratcher.
aww thank you Spider boogie:) loves ya much:)
and for you two (all seeing eye and squiddy) all i have to say is lol...
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*Note to Squiddy and The all seeing Eye:
Shut up. If you aren't Christian, leave it alone. It looks to me like you're just finding a pitiful excuse to slam Christians. I, being a Christian, think Jesus doesn't give a hoot about seeing the symbol of his death. If I were him (which I'm obviously not), I wouldn't mind seeing crosses. In fact, I'd probably be happy that people remembered what I did for them. Just let Rachel believe what she wants to believe, and drop it. You've both given me bad headaches.
You choose to enter this thread, deal with it.
If ratcher is going to be a twit and repeat the same thing over and over without addressing squiddy's point then she has no argument.
Will you shut your trap already? Maybe Rachel does have no argument, but that's no reason to call her a twit. And her name's Rachel, not Ratcher.
aww thank you Spider boogie:) loves ya much:)
and for you two (all seeing eye and squiddy) all i have to say is lol...
Thanks Rach! :-)
Anyway, like Squiddy said, we should get back on topic.